Immoral Laws

Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death immoral?

Here is josepw's opinion.

It wasn't the law that was immoral.

No-brainer.

Subjective Question
Can your god (as far as you are concerned) make any law and that makes it moral?

This is one of those topics where some differentiation needs to be made between "sin" and "immorality", I think.

I think stoning and killing a woman for adultery is completely immoral. It is a shockingly disproportionate over-reaction to non-conformity, at best, and an example of the "evil" of horrific, salacious, censorious mob rule, at worst.

I can understand that religious people might see adultery as "sin", however I do not see "sin" and immorality as being one in the same. I do not believe there is such a thing as "sin", for obvious reasons. However, I think in many cases adultery involves immoral acts ~ if it harms someone and if it involves deception ~ and therefore I think it is wrong in such cases.

So called "adultery" in an 'open marriage' where there is honesty and consent does not constitute immorality in my view, although I understand how some would see it as being "sinful".

I understand the place of the institution of marriage within the context of social order and I understand reactionary wishes to not see the social order undermined or disturbed. Indeed, enforcing this order is probably how the man made concept of "sin" originated and developed.

However, the 'judicial murder' of an adulteress is immoral to an umpteenth higher degree and far worse in moral terms than even the most egregious instance of adultery.

Yep, no sin, no morality, no hell. All that can be known is that if there is a God, he just smiles and sends them all to the same heaven when they die. 😵

Originally posted by whodey
Yep, no sin, no morality, no hell. All that can be known is that if there is a God, he just smiles and sends them all to the same heaven when they die. 😵

Who has said "no morality"?

Which God figure is believed to send everyone to "heaven"?

Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death for adultery immoral?

Originally posted by FMF
Who has said "no morality"?

Which God figure is believed to send everyone to "heaven"?

Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death for adultery immoral?

It's all good FMF. How did John Lennon put it? Just imagine, no heave and no hell, just one big happy family. 😵

Originally posted by whodey
It's all good FMF. How did John Lennon put it? Just imagine, no heave and no hell, just one big happy family. 😵

You said: "Yep, no sin, no morality, no hell. All that can be known is that if there is a God, he just smiles and sends them all to the same heaven when they die." Who among us here has ever said there is "no morality" or advocated such a thing? And according to whom and about which supposed God figure is it believed that He will send everyone to "heaven"?

Originally posted by whodey
Yep, no sin, no morality, no hell. All that can be known is that if there is a God, he just smiles and sends them all to the same heaven when they die. 😵

What about the OP question? Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death for adultery immoral?

Discussions on morality here are so primitive. 😕

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death immoral?

Here is josepw's opinion.

It wasn't the law that was immoral.

No-brainer.

Subjective Question
Can your god (as far as you are concerned) make any law and that makes it moral?

There are bits in the OT which date from a previous civilization and which no longer apply. No sane Christian should believe everything in the OT, much less practise everything in there. Sacrificing live animals on stone altars, for example. Keeping slaves and concubines, for example. Stoning adulteresses, for example. Further examples are legion. Read Leviticus, you'll see what I mean: it's all about which ear of the animal to anoint before you slit it's throat.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death immoral?

Here is josepw's opinion.

It wasn't the law that was immoral.

No-brainer.

Subjective Question
Can your god (as far as you are concerned) make any law and that makes it moral?

It has been a revelation to me in these last 12 months (and to my bitter disappointment and dismay) that many of the Christians here are trapped in the same paradigm as the crazy murdering butchers who are beheading people on the internet.

I say this without any intent to shock and in complete honesty - I think many Christians here have had their moral compass profoundly affected by their religious upbringing. To believe...I mean to REALLY believe that it is ok for their version of god to burn people for eternity for not believing in him is by its definition, infinitely worse than cutting someone's head of for the same crime.

The darkest (and often most powerful) elements of the Islamic engine remain in the Old Testament mindset and very sad to say some Christians here are also. Of course they will all pout and slap their hands on the table in exclamation that they would never approve of stoning someone for adultery - well never mind the splinter, think about the LOG of eternal suffering in burning hell.

Morality? It's a contemporary convenience and an optional add on as long as it doesn't contravene the "medieval" for some here. In my opinion.

At some point I shall find the energy and emotional fortitude to ask sonship about the morality framework on these "other worlds" that he talks about; whether they have a Bible that talks about eternal suffering whether they share our physical, spiritual and moral DNA. But then I take a step back and realise what incredible error and lunacy he speaks.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
Is a law requiring a woman to be stoned to death immoral?

Here is josepw's opinion.

It wasn't the law that was immoral.

No-brainer.

Subjective Question
Can your god (as far as you are concerned) make any law and that makes it moral?

Originally posted by FMF
So the law calling for her to be stoned for adultery is a moral law, is that your view?

Originally posted by josephw
Is God immoral that He should give an immoral law?

The above quotes were made on page 24 of the thread you are misquoting from. On page 25 FMF asked the following question;

Originally posted by FMF
Why didn't he condemn the law calling for her to be stoned for adultery as an immoral law?

To which I answered;

Originally posted by josephw
It wasn't the law that was immoral.

According to the law of God adultery is immoral. God doesn't make immoral laws. The law of God calling adultery immoral and punishable by death is moral whether anyone likes it or not.

Anyone that presumes to contradict the law of God as immoral does so at their own risk.

"Can your god (as far as you are concerned) make any law and that makes it moral?"

The law of God is a reflection of the nature and character of a holy God, who is the absolute embodiment of truth and righteousness. God is perfect beyond comprehension and can do no wrong.

Your question is misleading and defies reason by misrepresenting God's nature. God makes laws that reveals the moral character of His person. When one presumes to question the moral veracity of God's law one is essentially placing themselves above God in truth and righteousness.

Originally posted by moonbus
There are bits in the OT which date from a previous civilization and which no longer apply.

Do you think they were moral when they did apply? If not, then why did you say that sentence?

Originally posted by josephw
According to the law of God adultery is immoral. God doesn't make immoral laws. The law of God calling adultery immoral and punishable by death is moral whether anyone likes it or not. Anyone that presumes to contradict the law of God as immoral does so at their own risk.

The killing of a woman for adultery is a moral atrocity. If it were to happen today, anywhere in the world, would you not condemn it without hesitation? A law that made provision for such savage inhumanity would be a sign of its times and a sign of the prevailing culture-based God concept in that time and place.

Originally posted by divegeester
It has been a revelation to me in these last 12 months (and to my bitter disappointment and dismay) that many of the Christians here are trapped in the same paradigm as the crazy murdering butchers who are beheading people on the internet.

I say this without any intent to shock and in complete honesty - I think many Christians here have had their mor ...[text shortened]... d moral DNA. But then I take a step back and realise what incredible error and lunacy he speaks.

So what should be done to the likes of someone like Hitler who murdered miliions and sent more to their deaths via his wars? Or what should be done to the likes of Stalin who murdered far more?

You don't know? Why then sit in judgement of the Almighty? Let him have his way. Those who wrote about hell are writing if inspired by God. If you don't believe they are inspired, then fine. But if they are......what then?