German moon rover to prove men went there:

Originally posted by Suzianne
Maybe you can answer this question.

Would the ascent stages of the lunar modules be on the moon somewhere, or were they ejected after leaving lunar orbit (on the way home)?

The ascent stages were part of the whole craft going home. That would be because getting off the moon, especially since it has no atmosphere to speak of, the energy to get off the moon is 1/6th that of Earth, 600 pounds on Earth weighs 100 pounds or so on the moon, so you are lifting a lot less weight off the ground. So they didn't need to have any of the ascent stuff disappear later. They left the descent module with the rovers and instruments and such, and out of the 6 landings they brought back over 1000 pounds of moon rock, one of which I was allowed to hold in my hand. That was a FINE day I can tell you!

Originally posted by Deputy Daddy
December 11 will mark the 44th anniversary since the last man has walked on the moon....the moon simply is not relevant any more. Even if man did go there, lots can happen in 44 years. 12 men have walked on the moon, in the grand scheme of things, how much evidence could they really have left behind?

Are you really willing to learn like your blurb says? EVEN if man did go there? So you still question the whole deal. I assume then you were maybe not even born in 1970 or 69 so you just believe the treasonous asssholes whose motive is simply to make money selling their scam books.

Here's the deal: the technology to fake the moon landing did not exist back then. I can personally attest to the primitive state of computers back then, they didn't even have screens or keyboards much less software to do the kind of graphics we see in the stupid kids movies of today.

At the time, one of my jobs besides Apollo, was the ANALOG computer that was used for one thing: to simulate whether or not a spinning satellite that would have boxes inside at some positions around the inside, the question was, would it spin straight or would it start wobbling. The analog comp that did that job did it's job pretty well and a lot faster than the digital comps of the day but they were a pain in the ass to program.

How that happened, was they had a patch panel with something like a thousand tie points you soldered point to point wires that would go to various kinds of electronics, like OP amps, differential units, integrators, and getting the parameters in took almost a week of solid work soldering hundreds of contacts together.

That was just for one simulation. To do another one with more stuff inside or a cube shape required yet another patch panel so it was quite a job going from one simulation to another.

So my boss ATT, Horst Schlingloff, an MSEE, designed a link between the primitive digital computers of the day, to control the inputs of a slightly more advanced analog computer which had motor driven pots which you could then use to simulate stuff.

So now, to change from one simulation to another, you 'just' reprogrammed the digital machine, which had it's own set of pains to program, they had to use punched cards, one for each step of a program and you might have 2000 of those cards all being read by a card reader and then into the comp. But it was still a lot faster than having me wire up a whole patch panel one wire at a time with literally dozens or hundreds of interconnections.

That was state of the art back then. There was ABSOLUTELY no way they could simulate walking around on the moon with the crap from 2001, Space Odyssey kind of stuff they had back then. One problem is they had no way of knowing, for instance, just what it would look like when dust was kicked up by boots on the moon dust. They had to see that for real on the moon to be able to do that with any kind of accuracy.

Another thing, it was AMERICANS who wrote the moon landing denier books. If ANYONE on the planet had anything to gain from such treason, it would have been the Soviets, they would have jumped on that like a dog on a bone. But they didn't. You know why? Because they TRIED and failed, and they had decent radar back then and they tracked Apollo craft to the moon. They KNEW we went there, there was no question in their minds and if you think there was some kind of grand conspiracy, the Soviets would have to have been in on it and that is something they would never have done in a million years. They would have been screaming from the floor of the UN building the day they found out it was faked.

Like I said, IMHO, making up fake moon landing stories was treason against the US, plain and simple and those asssholes should have been shoved in prison.

Thanks for posting. It is sobering to realize that my Nokia C5 not-very-smart phone has more computing power than the mainframes which steered the Saturn 5 rockets.

Originally posted by sonhouse
I did my bit. I worked Apollo, tracking and timing to be exact. Till Nixon killed the space program. I was at Goddard Space flight center in Maryland. I don't need to thump my chest on other people's accomplishments you turd.

Wow, a Grammy winning musician, the brain behind the Apollo
program... what else? Did you singlehandedly defeat the enemy at
the Ardennes?

Originally posted by Seitse
Wow, a Grammy winning musician, the brain behind the Apollo
program... what else? Did you singlehandedly defeat the enemy at
the Ardennes?

Fluck you and the hearse you rode in on. Why don't you parade YOUR accomplishments, eh. Tell us, oh wonder boy, what you did in your life.

Originally posted by sonhouse
Fluck you and the hearse you rode in on. Why don't you parade YOUR accomplishments, eh. Tell us, oh wonder boy, what you did in your life.

Here? On an anonymous chess website?

I'm not a loser. Or maybe I am. You'll never know, sweetie.

Talk to divegeester, he likes to make lifelong friends here.

Originally posted by sonhouse
The ascent stages were part of the whole craft going home. That would be because getting off the moon, especially since it has no atmosphere to speak of, the energy to get off the moon is 1/6th that of Earth, 600 pounds on Earth weighs 100 pounds or so on the moon, so you are lifting a lot less weight off the ground. So they didn't need to have any of the a ...[text shortened]... of moon rock, one of which I was allowed to hold in my hand. That was a FINE day I can tell you!

Well, yeah, I get that the moon has less gravity.

What I was wondering is where the ascent stages were ejected, because they sure as hell didn't bring them back to earth. If they were ejected in lunar orbit, they would have eventually fallen to the moon's surface, but if they were ejected anywhere on the way home, they could be anywhere. I wouldn't think they would waste fuel bringing them all the way back to earth orbit, and that would be a big chunk of metal to eventually fall to earth.

I know the ascent stages were pretty light, probably flimsy would be a good word for them, so maybe they would burn up in earth's atmosphere, I dunno. But I doubt they'd waste fuel bringing it all the way home. What I was wondering is if it would be logical to assume the ascent stages' wreckage could be found somewhere on the moon or if they ejected them after leaving lunar orbit.

Originally posted by sonhouse
Are you really willing to learn like your blurb says? EVEN if man did go there? So you still question the whole deal. I assume then you were maybe not even born in 1970 or 69 so you just believe the treasonous asssholes whose motive is simply to make money selling their scam books.

Here's the deal: the technology to fake the moon landing did not exist b ...[text shortened]... treason against the US, plain and simple and those asssholes should have been shoved in prison.

The moon just does not hold the same power or interest it once did. A moon landing today would be far from just routine as noone has been there in 44 years. If NASA really wants to capture the interest of the public, they should start a colony, make it a reality show. Have people go on a 5-10 year mission to the moon where they will set up more permanent residence....seems much more viable than a one way trip to Mars.

Originally posted by Deputy Daddy
The moon just does not hold the same power or interest it once did. A moon landing today would be far from just routine as noone has been there in 44 years. If NASA really wants to capture the interest of the public, they should start a colony, make it a reality show. Have people go on a 5-10 year mission to the moon where they will set up more permanent residence....seems much more viable than a one way trip to Mars.

In case you haven't realized it, NASA is not in the business of "capturing the interest of the public". They do science. Maybe you've heard of it. Most of what they do is boring, but necessary.

I'm pretty sure that what is stopping a moon base from happening is the continual commitment to support it while humans are there. No one in politics in America has that kind of political will any more. This is why I predict the first moon base will not be American. Maybe Chinese.

Originally posted by Seitse
Here? On an anonymous chess website?

I'm not a loser. Or maybe I am. You'll never know, sweetie.

Talk to divegeester, he likes to make lifelong friends here.

Oh come, come, you have people here you really like your biting edgy wit and your funny posts about poo and willies and medical issues. Drewnogal for example is one of your fangirls. I think your are being too hard on yourself.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Well, yeah, I get that the moon has less gravity.

What I was wondering is where the ascent stages were ejected, because they sure as hell didn't bring them back to earth. If they were ejected in lunar orbit, they would have eventually fallen to the moon's surface, but if they were ejected anywhere on the way home, they could be anywhere. I wouldn't thi ...[text shortened]... wreckage could be found somewhere on the moon or if they ejected them after leaving lunar orbit.

You are right, I had forgotten about that bit, when the 2 man crew got back to the orbiter, they ducked inside and chucked the ascent module and it could have crashed into the moon but that would have depended on just how fast the ascent module was going and which direction, since they had to match with the orbiter/return vessel, the ascent module could still be in orbit, there isn't much atmosphere to slow it down like being say 100 miles above Earth. It would have had the velocity of the orbiter and when separated would have retained that velocity. My guess is they are still in orbit around the moon. Don't know if they tracked them or not. Radar would have enough resolution to track them if they wanted to. A quick check with Wiki, all the ascent stages were deliberately crashed on the moon. Not sure how they managed that trick though, Maybe there was enough fuel in the ascent module to fire the rockets to slow it down enough to crash.

Found this site that tells most of the story, a lot I didn't know, the only thing I had to worry about was my tracking and timing stuff.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_program

Originally posted by Seitse
Here? On an anonymous chess website?

I'm not a loser. Or maybe I am. You'll never know, sweetie.

Talk to divegeester, he likes to make lifelong friends here.

Actually, we ALREADY know.

Originally posted by divegeester
Oh come, come, you have people here you really like your biting edgy wit and your funny posts about poo and willies and medical issues. Drewnogal for example is one of your fangirls. I think your are being too hard on yourself.

Sorry, I can't understand you, with all that FMF meat stuffed in your mouth.

Originally posted by sonhouse
Actually, we ALREADY know.

Birds of a feather, sweetie.

When will you send me your autograph to the mental institution
where I live? We love the fake moon landing and wannabe musicians
here.

Originally posted by Seitse
Birds of a feather, sweetie.

When will you send me your autograph to the mental institution
where I live? We love the fake moon landing and wannabe musicians
here.

Talking out your ass again. It works better if you just fart, it smells sweeter. I have 50 tracks on soundcloud, if you even know what that is and 3 hours on dropbox. I wouldn't present you with it for all the tea in china.