Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Joined
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    22 Jun '19 12:42
    Is this OK with everyone? Bernie says illegals (invaders) have a Right to Healthcare..... Every person walking around in the United States. If he gives Eduardo a right to free medical care, then, since we pay for it, Bernie has effectively burdened me and my family with the obligation to pay for it.

    Is this cool with anyone on this forum? Explain?
  2. Subscriberkevcvs57
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    22 Jun '19 13:12
    @averagejoe1 said
    Is this OK with everyone? Bernie says illegals (invaders) have a Right to Healthcare..... Every person walking around in the United States. If he gives Eduardo a right to free medical care, then, since we pay for it, Bernie has effectively burdened me and my family with the obligation to pay for it.

    Is this cool with anyone on this forum? Explain?
    Bernie has not been voted into office so he can say anything he likes it still doesn’t burden you or anybody else.
    If he gets elected to the presidency and he can get this through congress or by executive order even though he’s been honest enough to make it part of his platform then it’s as fair as any other burden derived from your democratic process.
    You were ok with Trump burdening the tax payers with the cost of a wall.
  3. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    22 Jun '19 13:14
    @averagejoe1 said
    Is this OK with everyone? Bernie says illegals (invaders) have a Right to Healthcare..... Every person walking around in the United States. If he gives Eduardo a right to free medical care, then, since we pay for it, Bernie has effectively burdened me and my family with the obligation to pay for it.

    Is this cool with anyone on this forum? Explain?
    It would not make sense to give free healthcare to illegal aliens.

    Of course, we have to treat them for their injuries, but we also have to repatriate them.

    If we actually had a really efficient system of repatriation where we stopped them at the border, this wouldn't be such a big deal.

    But, instead, our system is broken.
  4. SubscriberSuzianne
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    22 Jun '19 13:23
    @philokalia said
    It would not make sense to give free healthcare to illegal aliens.

    Of course, we have to treat them for their injuries, but we also have to repatriate them.

    If we actually had a really efficient system of repatriation where we stopped them at the border, this wouldn't be such a big deal.

    But, instead, our system is broken.
    What about asylum seekers?

    Same thing to you, isn't it?
  5. Alabama
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    22 Jun '19 13:57

    Removed by poster

  6. Standard memberDeepThought
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    22 Jun '19 14:13
    @philokalia said
    It would not make sense to give free healthcare to illegal aliens.

    Of course, we have to treat them for their injuries, but we also have to repatriate them.

    If we actually had a really efficient system of repatriation where we stopped them at the border, this wouldn't be such a big deal.

    But, instead, our system is broken.
    Free healthcare for aliens won't work because the organ layout is different and they can't tolerate human blood.
  7. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    22 Jun '19 14:25
    @suzianne said
    What about asylum seekers?

    Same thing to you, isn't it?
    How are Guatemalans, El Salvadorans, and Mexicans seeking asylum?

    You don't get to seek asylum because your country has a low standard of living.

    You have to be actually being persecuted by your government for that to be a meaningful form of application. Anyone who has expanded the definition beyond that is using it as a political tool.
  8. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    22 Jun '19 14:351 edit
    @philokalia said
    It would not make sense to give free healthcare to illegal aliens.

    Of course, we have to treat them for their injuries, but we also have to repatriate them.

    If we actually had a really efficient system of repatriation where we stopped them at the border, this wouldn't be such a big deal.

    But, instead, our system is broken.
    You call them 'illegal aliens' and Average Joe 'invaders.'

    Personally, I prefer 'fellow human beings'.
  9. Subscriberkevcvs57
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    22 Jun '19 14:38
    @deepthought said
    Free healthcare for aliens won't work because the organ layout is different and they can't tolerate human blood.
    Well, you say that, but...
  10. Joined
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    22 Jun '19 14:42
    @averagejoe1 said
    Is this OK with everyone? Bernie says illegals (invaders) have a Right to Healthcare..... Every person walking around in the United States. If he gives Eduardo a right to free medical care, then, since we pay for it, Bernie has effectively burdened me and my family with the obligation to pay for it.

    Is this cool with anyone on this forum? Explain?
    I personally would want to fact-check any claim that is worded like “Bernie says illegals (invaders) have a Right to Healthcare...”. But the burden of proof is on the person making the claim, in my book.
  11. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    22 Jun '19 14:44
    @ghost-of-a-duke said
    You call them 'illegal aliens' and Average Joe 'invaders.'

    Personally, I prefer 'fellow human beings'.
    Haha, OK.

    You are right: they are our fellow humans.

    But there is a distinction between a citizen, a non-citizen who is legally there, and a non-citizen who is illegally there.

    What do you prefer to call a non-citizen who is illegally there in this context?

    "Alien" has been the go to word in Englishf or a long time.

    You know what every LEGAL alien resident of Korea has?

    In English, it is called an "Alien Registration Card."

    This is not abnormal language at all.
  12. Subscriberno1marauder
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    22 Jun '19 15:011 edit
    @philokalia said
    Haha, OK.

    You are right: they are our fellow humans.

    But there is a distinction between a citizen, a non-citizen who is legally there, and a non-citizen who is illegally there.

    What do you prefer to call a non-citizen who is illegally there in this context?

    "Alien" has been the go to word in Englishf or a long time.

    You know what every ...[text shortened]...

    In English, it is called an "Alien Registration Card."

    This is not abnormal language at all.
    What happen to a North Korean seeking asylum in South Korea? Are then sent back at the border because they are "invaders"?

    EDIT: Actually as soon as a North Korean sets foot on South Korean soil, he is automatically granted citizenship even if they don't want it. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/north-korea-defectors-canada-1.4785235
  13. Subscriberno1marauder
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    22 Jun '19 15:031 edit
    @philokalia said
    How are Guatemalans, El Salvadorans, and Mexicans seeking asylum?

    You don't get to seek asylum because your country has a low standard of living.

    You have to be actually being persecuted by your government for that to be a meaningful form of application. Anyone who has expanded the definition beyond that is using it as a political tool.
    Those countries have had a lower standard of living than the US for a long time.

    Why do you think people from Central America are seeking asylum here in such large numbers all of sudden? Do you know anything about the conditions there?
  14. Germany
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    22 Jun '19 15:08
    @philokalia said
    Haha, OK.

    You are right: they are our fellow humans.

    But there is a distinction between a citizen, a non-citizen who is legally there, and a non-citizen who is illegally there.

    What do you prefer to call a non-citizen who is illegally there in this context?

    "Alien" has been the go to word in Englishf or a long time.

    You know what every ...[text shortened]...

    In English, it is called an "Alien Registration Card."

    This is not abnormal language at all.
    "The foreigners residing among you must be treated as native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the Lord your God." - Leviticus 19:34
  15. SubscriberGhost of a Duke
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    22 Jun '19 19:06
    @philokalia said
    Haha, OK.

    You are right: they are our fellow humans.

    But there is a distinction between a citizen, a non-citizen who is legally there, and a non-citizen who is illegally there.

    What do you prefer to call a non-citizen who is illegally there in this context?

    "Alien" has been the go to word in Englishf or a long time.

    You know what every ...[text shortened]...

    In English, it is called an "Alien Registration Card."

    This is not abnormal language at all.
    A few years back, here in London, we had several days of riots (fuelled and organized via social media). Quite a scary time with buildings being set on fire and shops looted etc. On one day in particular, the area where I live was targeted and the streets were full of police and determined looters.

    Anyway, we heard a commotion in our back garden and discovered a young chap had jumped over our wall and taken a bad fall. (Probably trying to flee from the police). I guess I could have viewed him as an invader or an unwelcome alien who was there in my garden illegally. I could have declined to offer him medical help and immediately reported him to the authorities to have him removed.

    I didn't of course. While I helped him attend to his wound (a nasty gash on his leg) my wife made him a cup of tea. - You may disagree (which would be odd seeing as I am the atheist and you the theist), but as a 'fellow human being' I felt obligated to help him, even though he wasn't meant to be there. I'd even go as far as to say that he had the 'right' to receive my help, purely on the grounds of being a 'fellow human being.'
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