Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Standard membershavixmir
    Guppy poo
    Sewers of Holland
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    01 Aug '18 01:59
    There are various ways a society is judged.

    One way is historically. For example: slavery. Pretty much weighed and judged by our norms today.

    Another way is how we treat criminals. The harsher, the more more violent and sexist a society is.

    Yet another way, I guess, is how a society treats its sick:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-45009078

    I’ve heard tales of injured people in Switzerland being asked to prove they’re insured, before being helicoptered off a mountain (in the 80’s).

    But this is today in Florida:
    Four US paramedics accused of racially profiling and failing to provide medical care to a dying woman face a disciplinary hearing on Tuesday.
    Crystle Galloway's mother says medics assumed the Tampa, Florida, family could not afford the ambulance cost.


    A trillion a year pumped into the armed services, more secret agencies financed than braincells in the president... and denying a sick person a bloody ambulance?

    Now, the article is about racial profiling... but if you ask me, denying someone medical aid because they can’t afford an ambulance (whether imagined or not) is surely a sign of a society rotting to its core.

    “If we can’t or won’t take care of each other, we’re no longer fit to call ourselves a society.”
    - M. Born -
  2. Standard memberkaroly aczel
    The Axe man
    Brisbane,QLD
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    01 Aug '18 04:431 edit
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    There are various ways a society is judged.

    One way is historically. For example: slavery. Pretty much weighed and judged by our norms today.

    Another way is how we treat criminals. The harsher, the more more violent and sexist a society is.

    Yet another way, I guess, is how a society treats its sick:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-450 ...[text shortened]... or won’t take care of each other, we’re no longer fit to call ourselves a society.”
    - M. Born -
    You are absolutely right.
    After all the chances of needing an ambulance are slim. Many will not even consider points like this, (a direct affront to the statute of human rights), to be a priority when voting.
  3. Standard memberwolfgang59
    Mr. Wolf
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    01 Aug '18 05:17
    Elsewhere in US (a few days earlier) a woman (bleeding badly)
    refused an ambulance because she didn't want the $3,000 debt!!!

    Strangely we pay for ambulances (c. $100) in NZ but treatment is FREE.
  4. Standard membersh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    New York
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    01 Aug '18 15:10
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    There are various ways a society is judged.

    One way is historically. For example: slavery. Pretty much weighed and judged by our norms today.

    Another way is how we treat criminals. The harsher, the more more violent and sexist a society is.

    Yet another way, I guess, is how a society treats its sick:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-450 ...[text shortened]... or won’t take care of each other, we’re no longer fit to call ourselves a society.”
    - M. Born -
    Here's a hint, Shav: When people are accused of misconduct and face disciplinary hearings, it is not usually because their society endorses their conduct.
  5. Joined
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    01 Aug '18 16:19
    Originally posted by @sh76
    Here's a hint, Shav: When people are accused of misconduct and face disciplinary hearings, it is not usually because their society endorses their conduct.
    can you admit it might be worrying? That ambulance paramedics would hesitate to do their job because the patient cannot afford to continue living?

    Can you imagine that there were hints, meetings, some of their coworkers getting reprimanded when a patient couldn't pay the absurd cost of an ambulance? Would it be enough to make you investigate instead of dismissing it out of hand?


    Can you maybe admit that the system might not be working as it should when this happens?
  6. Joined
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    01 Aug '18 16:21
    Wouldn't it be surreal if the fire department asked for a deposit before coming over to put out your house?

    How about the police refusing to stop a rape in progress because the victim looked poor?
  7. SubscriberKingDavid403
    King David
    Planet Earth.
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    01 Aug '18 17:39
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    There are various ways a society is judged.

    One way is historically. For example: slavery. Pretty much weighed and judged by our norms today.

    Another way is how we treat criminals. The harsher, the more more violent and sexist a society is.

    Yet another way, I guess, is how a society treats its sick:

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-450 ...[text shortened]... or won’t take care of each other, we’re no longer fit to call ourselves a society.”
    - M. Born -
    But but.... Trump and Republicans said no one would be turned away from emergency care if needed, even if they shut off insurance for the 20 million or so under the Affordable Care Act. This just cannot be true... 😠🙄🙄🙄
  8. Joined
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    01 Aug '18 17:40
    Originally posted by @zahlanzi
    Wouldn't it be surreal if the fire department asked for a deposit before coming over to put out your house?

    How about the police refusing to stop a rape in progress because the victim looked poor?
    So you found an individual in a country with over 300 million people who is being charged with committing a crime. Instead of recognizing that the person might actually be a criminal as charged or might be innocent as the act certainly might not have occurred at all, you infer without a shred of evidence that he was encouraged by his employer to commit the crime. Could you be more biased if you actually tried?
  9. Joined
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    01 Aug '18 17:47
    Originally posted by @zahlanzi
    Wouldn't it be surreal if the fire department asked for a deposit before coming over to put out your house?

    How about the police refusing to stop a rape in progress because the victim looked poor?
    Where was your outrage when veterans at the Arizona VA were put on secret death lists because their universal government coverage felt it would be better since they were so sick and expensive?
  10. SubscriberSuzianne
    Misfit Queen
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    01 Aug '18 20:06
    Originally posted by @whodey
    Where was your outrage when veterans at the Arizona VA were put on secret death lists because their universal government coverage felt it would be better since they were so sick and expensive?
    You and the so-called 'death lists'.

    How can you so casually lie?

    Because Fox News told you so?

    Even you can't be that monumentally stupid.

    Oh, wait, maybe because doing so promotes your sick agenda?

    I'd rather be known as stupid than calculating.
  11. Joined
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    01 Aug '18 21:091 edit
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    You and the so-called 'death lists'.

    How can you so casually lie?

    Because Fox News told you so?

    Even you can't be that monumentally stupid.

    Oh, wait, maybe because doing so promotes your sick agenda?

    I'd rather be known as stupid than calculating.
    No Suzy, Obama fired some poor soul that had nothing to do with it because of the very incident I was discussing.

    Educate yourself.

    https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/arizona/investigations/2014/05/31/va-scandal-whistleblower-sam-foote/9830057/
  12. Germany
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    01 Aug '18 21:14
    Originally posted by @whodey
    Where was your outrage when veterans at the Arizona VA were put on secret death lists because their universal government coverage felt it would be better since they were so sick and expensive?
    Weren't these veterans able to purchase private health insurance?
  13. Subscriberno1marauder
    Humble and Kind
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    01 Aug '18 22:51
    Originally posted by @whodey
    No Suzy, Obama fired some poor soul that had nothing to do with it because of the very incident I was discussing.

    Educate yourself.

    https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/arizona/investigations/2014/05/31/va-scandal-whistleblower-sam-foote/9830057/
    "Whataboutism" seems like your only response to anything these days, but what "poor soul that had nothing to do with it" was fired by Obama because of the scandals in the Arizona VA? Nor does the article even support your "death list" claim:

    He added that news coverage exploded in part because some media incorrectly reported the allegation about 40 deaths, saying veterans died because of delays in care. Although anecdotal evidence suggests that may be true, Foote said, he only asserted that veterans died while awaiting care, and the cause remains to be proven.
  14. Joined
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    01 Aug '18 23:32
    Originally posted by @suzianne
    You and the so-called 'death lists'.

    How can you so casually lie?

    Because Fox News told you so?

    Even you can't be that monumentally stupid.

    Oh, wait, maybe because doing so promotes your sick agenda?

    I'd rather be known as stupid than calculating.
    "I'd rather be known as stupid than calculating."

    you should be satisfied then.
  15. Standard memberwolfgang59
    Mr. Wolf
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    01 Aug '18 23:381 edit
    Originally posted by @whodey
    Where was your outrage when veterans at the Arizona VA were put on secret death lists because their universal government coverage felt it would be better since they were so sick and expensive?
    😲
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