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Debates Forum

  1. 20 Feb '13 01:26
    http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8939251/dj-pettway-4-alabama-crimson-tide-freshmen-facing-charges

    Is the punishment too harsh, not harsh enough or just right?
  2. 20 Feb '13 02:09 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by normbenign
    http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8939251/dj-pettway-4-alabama-crimson-tide-freshmen-facing-charges

    Is the punishment too harsh, not harsh enough or just right?
    If they signed some sort of conduct stipulations when they got their scholarships (it's a safe bet they got scholarships or assistance of some sort) then I would look at the wording of that. (Or, maybe the school has such written requirements irrespective of scholarships, at least I think the school is on shaky ground if it doesn't have written requirements.)

    My only reservations would be that they should only be suspended until the trial is complete, and compare the conduct for which they are convicted (if convicted) to the school's standards. (This might affect how they plea, if a plea bargain might save their career possibilities.) Of course if kicked out, they can shop junior colleges with the hope of later college play after a period of good behavior. This is after a possible jail term.
  3. 20 Feb '13 14:32
    Originally posted by JS357
    If they signed some sort of conduct stipulations when they got their scholarships (it's a safe bet they got scholarships or assistance of some sort) then I would look at the wording of that. (Or, maybe the school has such written requirements irrespective of scholarships, at least I think the school is on shaky ground if it doesn't have written requirements.) ...[text shortened]... pe of later college play after a period of good behavior. This is after a possible jail term.
    This was an example of what's come to be called "The Knockout Game". The victims are most often white or asian, often gay, old or weak.

    These kds were four and five star recruits, with playing time as freshmen on a national championship team. Full ride scholarships. There is little doubt they will find somewhere to play, after prison time. If they can get their act together in the meantime.
  4. 20 Feb '13 15:05
    The federal government should ban granting scholarships based on sporting credentials or any other non-academic criteria.
  5. 20 Feb '13 15:46 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    The federal government should ban granting scholarships based on sporting credentials or any other non-academic criteria.
    Why would the federal government want to make it harder for someone to get a scholarship?
  6. 20 Feb '13 15:53
    Originally posted by quackquack
    Why would the federal government want to make it harder for someone to get a scholarship?
    Well, in the ideal case there is no or just a symbolic tuition (for non-private institutions). But if a scholarship has to be awarded, ideally it should be awarded based on academic criteria so that the brighest students get educated instead of whomever happens to be the best at throwing a ball, black or Buddhist.
  7. 20 Feb '13 16:14
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    Well, in the ideal case there is no or just a symbolic tuition (for non-private institutions). But if a scholarship has to be awarded, ideally it should be awarded based on academic criteria so that the brighest students get educated instead of whomever happens to be the best at throwing a ball, black or Buddhist.
    But if a third party wants to pay a tuition (that exists in the real world even if you believe it should not), what interest does the government have in stopping the scholarship?
  8. 20 Feb '13 17:02
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    The federal government should ban granting scholarships based on sporting credentials or any other non-academic criteria.
    The notion of the "student athlete" is oxymoronic. Big time college sports are really the ego trips of alumni. It also provides a false incentive to the young people involved, at least in many major programs. Youngsters in high school are sold the scholarship carrot, and the remote possibility of a professional sports career. Many, fail to make the most of the scholarship opportunity reaching for the fool's gold of pro sports.

    Despite this, I think the federal government ought to stay clear of colleges and college sports.
  9. 20 Feb '13 17:09
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    Well, in the ideal case there is no or just a symbolic tuition (for non-private institutions). But if a scholarship has to be awarded, ideally it should be awarded based on academic criteria so that the brighest students get educated instead of whomever happens to be the best at throwing a ball, black or Buddhist.
    "Well, in the ideal case there is no or just a symbolic tuition (for non-private institutions)."

    When I was in college in my late forties, a gentlemen pointed out something that has stuck with me. People don't value what they do not pay for! Examples: Those who paid for their classes, where offended when bad weather, or other reasons cancelled classes, which we paid for and expected to receive. Younger students, on scholarship or on Daddy's dime, celebrated such cancellations, descending on local watering holes for fun. The older students were always at the top of their classes, while many non payers dropped classes after a few weeks, or stuck around and failed.

    Free is bad, but of course the costs need not be what they are, and I agree that scholarships ought to be for scholars.
  10. 21 Feb '13 06:35 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by normbenign
    "Well, in the ideal case there is no or just a symbolic tuition (for non-private institutions)."

    When I was in college in my late forties, a gentlemen pointed out something that has stuck with me. People don't value what they do not pay for! Examples: Those who paid for their classes, where offended when bad weather, or other reasons cancelled classe the costs need not be what they are, and I agree that scholarships ought to be for scholars.
    Spoilt brats who live on daddy's dime are not necessarily the same people as those following a taxpayer-funded education.
  11. 21 Feb '13 12:32
    Two vicious physical attacks knocking students out, some prison time seems to be in order:

    http://www.tuscaloosanews.com/article/20130212/NEWS/130219947/1015/sports?p=1&tc=pg&tc=ar
  12. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    21 Feb '13 15:02
    Originally posted by normbenign
    http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8939251/dj-pettway-4-alabama-crimson-tide-freshmen-facing-charges

    Is the punishment too harsh, not harsh enough or just right?
    Too harsh???

    What?

    They intentionally beat somebody up for no reason and robbed him. Is there a question as to whether suspension from a football team is too harsh?

    3 years in prison would not be too harsh.
  13. 21 Feb '13 19:05
    Originally posted by sh76
    Too harsh???

    What?

    They intentionally beat somebody up for no reason and robbed him. Is there a question as to whether suspension from a football team is too harsh?

    3 years in prison would not be too harsh.
    Believe it or not, the first article I saw on this was on ESPN on line, and the writer thought that Sabin was too harsh in kicking them off the team.
  14. 21 Feb '13 19:06
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    Spoilt brats who live on daddy's dime are not necessarily the same people as those following a taxpayer-funded education.
    True, but the same lack of appreciation for free stuff applies generally to all who get the freebies, with a few exceptions.
  15. 21 Feb '13 20:26 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by normbenign
    http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8939251/dj-pettway-4-alabama-crimson-tide-freshmen-facing-charges

    Is the punishment too harsh, not harsh enough or just right?
    Further to the OP, Alabama does not seem to have posted requirements concerning criminal allegations on its student athlete policy guide. It has guides fordrugs, gambling, etc.

    http://www.rolltide.com/compliance/student-athletes/