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  1. 20 Nov '15 03:27
    Jonathan Pollard, an American Jew, is the most notorious US citizen ever
    to be convicted of spying for Israel. According to the US government,
    Jonathan Pollard gave Israel a vast amount of top secret information.
    In 1987 Jonathan Pollard (who pleaded guilty) was sentenced to life in prison.

    During his imprisonment, there was a well-organized campaign (backed by
    Israel's government) to pressure US Presidents into pardoning Jonathan Pollard.
    Reportedly, several senior US intelligence officials threatened to resign
    their positions if their Presidents had succumbed to the pressure to free Pollard.
    Jonathan Pollard (now an Israeli citizen) is widely perceived in Israel as a
    hero who was unjustly persecuted in the USA for being a Jew who loved Israel.

    On Friday Jonathan Pollard will be released on parole from prison.
    Under federal parole rules, he cannot leave the USA without permission
    from the US government for at least five years. Israel's Prime MInister
    Netanyahu has appealed to US President Obama to permit Jonathan
    Pollard to leave immediately for Israel. Some pro-Israeli American
    politicians also support Jonathan Pollard.

    Should the US government make a special exception for Jonathan Pollard
    (an unrepentant spy for Israel) and permit him to leave the USA before
    the normal five year period for people on federal parole?
  2. 20 Nov '15 03:56 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    Jonathan Pollard, an American Jew, is the most notorious US citizen ever
    to be convicted of spying for Israel. According to the US government,
    Jonathan Pollard gave Israel a vast amount of top secret information.
    In 1987 Jonathan Pollard (who pleaded guilty) was sentenced to life in prison.

    During his imprisonment, there was a well-organized campaig ...[text shortened]... d permit him to leave the USA before
    the normal five year period for people on federal parole?
    what's another 5 years on parole
    he served 28 years of a life sentence
    ship him out or keep him here
    makes no difference to me

    edit: I remember when they would execute a spy
    seems he got off easy
  3. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    20 Nov '15 05:14
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    Jonathan Pollard, an American Jew, is the most notorious US citizen ever
    to be convicted of spying for Israel. According to the US government,
    Jonathan Pollard gave Israel a vast amount of top secret information.
    In 1987 Jonathan Pollard (who pleaded guilty) was sentenced to life in prison.

    During his imprisonment, there was a well-organized campaig ...[text shortened]... d permit him to leave the USA before
    the normal five year period for people on federal parole?
    Yes.

    Good riddance.
  4. 20 Nov '15 05:18
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    Jonathan Pollard, an American Jew, is the most notorious US citizen ever
    to be convicted of spying for Israel. According to the US government,
    Jonathan Pollard gave Israel a vast amount of top secret information.
    In 1987 Jonathan Pollard (who pleaded guilty) was sentenced to life in prison.

    During his imprisonment, there was a well-organized campaig ...[text shortened]... d permit him to leave the USA before
    the normal five year period for people on federal parole?
    I just watched "Bridge of Spies."

    Some questions: Is it in the US' interests to allow him to go without a quid pro quo, or is his retention a bargaining chip for something the US would like in return, or is he holding back on some useful information? Does Israel really want him back? Does he really want to go back?
  5. Standard member RJHinds
    The Near Genius
    20 Nov '15 06:26 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    Jonathan Pollard, an American Jew, is the most notorious US citizen ever
    to be convicted of spying for Israel. According to the US government,
    Jonathan Pollard gave Israel a vast amount of top secret information.
    In 1987 Jonathan Pollard (who pleaded guilty) was sentenced to life in prison.

    During his imprisonment, there was a well-organized campaig ...[text shortened]... d permit him to leave the USA before
    the normal five year period for people on federal parole?
    YES, absolutely he should be released. His acts did no harm to the USA and apparently aided Israel in their defense. I thought Israel was considered a friendly nation to the United States anyway. Obama has released many terrorist that did do us harm and this man is certainly no terrorist and would cause us no harm if released to Israel.


    http://www.jonathanpollard.org/facts.htm
  6. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    20 Nov '15 07:55
    Originally posted by JS357
    I just watched "Bridge of Spies."

    Some questions: Is it in the US' interests to allow him to go without a quid pro quo, or is his retention a bargaining chip for something the US would like in return, or is he holding back on some useful information? Does Israel really want him back? Does he really want to go back?
    The case dates back to the 1980s and he's been in federal prison since 1987; what information do you imagine he would have that could possibly be useful now?

    The question was should he be permitted to leave the US while on parole. If he doesn't want to or Israel doesn't want him the question is moot.
  7. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    20 Nov '15 11:17
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    The case dates back to the 1980s and he's been in federal prison since 1987; what information do you imagine he would have that could possibly be useful now?

    The question was should he be permitted to leave the US while on parole. If he doesn't want to or Israel doesn't want him the question is moot.
    Looks like Clinton pulled a fast one on Israel after the Israeli's let go 750 Palestinian murderers and still no quid pro pro from Clinton. He pardoned hundreds of real criminals yet continued to keep Pollard in prison.

    We will see whether Israel accepts Pollard with open arms.
  8. 20 Nov '15 11:33
    Pollard betrayed the US and gave top secret reports to a foreign nation.

    Obama has no choice but to let him go.
  9. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    20 Nov '15 12:30
    Originally posted by whodey
    Pollard betrayed the US and gave top secret reports to a foreign nation.

    Obama has no choice but to let him go.
    Top secrets? More of a betrayal of trust between Israel and the US by the various administrations come and gone in the meantime.

    We were supposed to have an agreement we would share vital intelligence but we deliberately withheld such information that we were honor bound to give. Pollard just figured that part out that the US was screwing Israel for whatever reason.

    He was never charged with treason. There was no reason Clinton could not have pardoned him with all the real criminals he pardoned when he left office.

    I suppose it's ok as far as you are concerned for the US to treat an ally that way.
  10. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    20 Nov '15 13:35 / 1 edit
    Pollard's life sentence was an abomination, though I don't really feel too badly for him; he made his own bed.

    Repentant or not, he did his time, and then some.

    28 years is plenty. They should let him go.
  11. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    20 Nov '15 14:04
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    Top secrets? More of a betrayal of trust between Israel and the US by the various administrations come and gone in the meantime.

    We were supposed to have an agreement we would share vital intelligence but we deliberately withheld such information that we were honor bound to give. Pollard just figured that part out that the US was screwing Israel for wha ...[text shortened]... office.

    I suppose it's ok as far as you are concerned for the US to treat an ally that way.
    The Rosenbergs got the electric chair for supposedly giving information to a wartime ally.

    Pollard got what he deserved. Plus he didn't do it for patriotism for Israel; he was paid cold, hard cash. Basically, he was a scumbag but 30 years in prison seems enough for me. Plus if he wants to go to Israel let him as long as he agrees to never come back to the US.
  12. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    20 Nov '15 14:09 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by whodey
    Pollard betrayed the US and gave top secret reports to a foreign nation.

    Obama has no choice but to let him go.
    You are typically ignorant and misinformed.

    Obama did not "let him go"; in fact the President has refused numerous requests for clemency or a pardon for Pollard. The US Parole Commission granted Pollard parole in accordance with federal guidelines in effect at the time and applicable to the case. Obama was requested to relieve Pollard of the five year requirement to remain in the US during the latter's 5 year parole period (this would be allowable under the President's pardoning power) but has refused to do so, at least so far.

    Try to get your facts straight once.
  13. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    20 Nov '15 14:12 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    The Rosenbergs got the electric chair for supposedly giving information to a wartime ally.

    Pollard got what he deserved. Plus he didn't do it for patriotism for Israel; he was paid cold, hard cash. Basically, he was a scumbag but 30 years in prison seems enough for me. Plus if he wants to go to Israel let him as long as he agrees to never come back to the US.
    I would have done exactly the same if I were a representative of the Israeli government and had found out the US was denying intelligence they had agreed to give Israel. No lives were lost as a result of Pollards' deeds. It's not like he sold atomic bomb secrets. You have built this up way out of proportion, just going along with whatever puke the US government spews about the issue. The fact is, the US withheld intelligence badly needed and deserved by the Israeli's but you are to brainwashed to see it. Israel should not have had to resort to the use of spies to get the information they had been promised.
  14. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    20 Nov '15 14:20 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    I would have done exactly the same if I were a representative of the Israeli government and had found out the US was denying intelligence they had agreed to give Israel. No lives were lost as a result of Pollards' deeds. It's not like he sold atomic bomb secrets. You have built this up way out of proportion, just going along with whatever puke the US govern ...[text shortened]... should not have had to resort to the use of spies to get the information they had been promised.
    The US has no obligation to give any foreign country intelligence information. Pollard was a paid spy and got what he deserved; he deliberately violated the conditions of his plea agreement which made the judge angry enough to give him the maximum sentence. Stop making him out to be a hero and Israel a saintly ally of the US; Israel had no problem sentencing its citizens to prison for supposedly spying on it on behalf of the US.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yosef_Amit

    EDIT: Ask the sailors who were on the USS Liberty on June 8, 1967 (the ones the Israelis didn't kill anyway) what a great ally of the US Israel was and is.
  15. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    20 Nov '15 14:33 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    The US has no obligation to give any foreign country intelligence information. Pollard was a paid spy and got what he deserved; he deliberately violated the conditions of his plea agreement which made the judge angry enough to give him the maximum sentence. Stop making him out to be a hero and Israel a saintly ally of the US; Israel had no problem senten ...[text shortened]... 1967 (the ones the Israelis didn't kill anyway) what a great ally of the US Israel was and is.
    The story is a bit more complex than I first thought. He is supposed to have sold Israel manuals and information about weapons and such besides just the info about intelligence and other US secrets to other country like Australia and Pakistan.

    What I read said the Israeli's used that information to get Israeli spies released by Russia.

    So maybe Pollard isn't quite the martyr I thought.

    I guess he won't be getting that dream job in the FBI now, eh.