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  1. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    11 Oct '10 14:44 / 1 edit
    Tea Party supporters want to 'take their country back'. To where?

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/oct/10/tea-party-arizona-midterms-undermine

    When the CNBC correspondent Rick Santelli became the first to call for a "tea party" to prevent the government bailing out the "losers' mortgages" in February 2009, these were the kind of losers he was referring to: those unlucky enough to have just signed on the dotted line when the good times stopped rolling. "This is America!" he yelled from the floor of the Chicago stock exchange. "How many of you people want to pay for your neighbour's mortgage that has an extra bathroom and can't pay their bills?" The traders booed.

    The only thing more stunning than the contempt that Republicans in general and the Tea Party in particular have shown for working- and middle-class Americans during this recent crisis is the propensity of those same Americans to back them.

    The issue here is not false-consciousness – the notion that people do not know what is right for them. There are legitimate philosophical reasons why people – including the poor – might be in favour of lower taxes and less government. But polling shows that when it comes to poverty, the elderly and education, if anything people want to do more rather than less.

    -snip-

    When Tea Party supporters talk about "taking our country back", they are – in part – expressing nostalgia. They literally want to take it backwards to a past when people had job security, and a couple on a middle-class wage could reasonably expect their children to have a better life than their own. The party they have been voting for and the candidates they are supporting now have actively and openly worked to undermine those aspirations. Their frustration at the Democrats' inability to deliver on their promises should be eclipsed only by their fear that the Republicans do manage to deliver on theirs. No wonder they are so angry. They keep treading on their own toes.


    Biased article, yes. But one that raised some interesting points.

    Is the Tea Party a populist movement? It sure purports to be. But if so, does it really advocate the best interests of the common people who support it?

    If not, why do they support it?
  2. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    11 Oct '10 15:15
    Originally posted by sh76
    [b]Tea Party supporters want to 'take their country back'. To where?

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/oct/10/tea-party-arizona-midterms-undermine

    [quote]When the CNBC correspondent Rick Santelli became the first to call for a "tea party" to prevent the government bailing out the "losers' mortgages" in February 2009, these were the kind of ...[text shortened]... nterests of the common people who support it?

    If not, why do they support it?[/b]
    Surveys have pretty much established that self-declared Tea Party members are overwhelmingly conservative Republicans or Republican leaners who have voted for Republicans in the past. Moreover, the movement is primarily funded by a few billionaires and right wing foundations. It's not a "populist" movement by any stretch of the imagination.

    The article overrates its importance and support.
  3. 11 Oct '10 15:34
    Its probably more of a "Media movement" than anything else.
  4. 11 Oct '10 15:38 / 1 edit
    Its also more of a "we don't like the government - especially Obama" movement, than an actual party or a pro-anything movement.
  5. 11 Oct '10 15:39
    Originally posted by sh76
    [b]Tea Party supporters want to 'take their country back'. To where?

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/oct/10/tea-party-arizona-midterms-undermine

    [quote]When the CNBC correspondent Rick Santelli became the first to call for a "tea party" to prevent the government bailing out the "losers' mortgages" in February 2009, these were the kind of ...[text shortened]... nterests of the common people who support it?

    If not, why do they support it?[/b]
    The tea party is not a political party.

    I think the true purpose of the tea party is to take attention away from minor political parties that might have a chance to gain popularity given that both major political parties have failed to represent most voters.

    I think the establishment wants to suppress the Libertarian and US taxpayer parties before they can gain ground. The reason (in my opinion) is to keep a 2 party system in place without instant runoff voting because it is easy to manipulate voters that way.

    If a true conservative political party were to emerge the republicans would be knocked out of their major political party status. After all, the republicans have proven they are not fiscally conservative at all. The tea party movement is designed to fool people into thinking there is still hope for fiscally conservative republicans if they vote for Palin endorsed republicans.

    It is all a farce. The tea party used to be (more or less) a Libertarian type of movement until it was hijacked by the republicans with the help of the corporate news media. Now the movement has lost its original identity and more or less promotes the status quo that has failed us.

    The more things change the more they stay the same.
  6. 11 Oct '10 15:42
    Originally posted by Metal Brain
    It is all a farce. The tea party used to be (more or less) a Libertarian type of movement until it was hijacked by the republicans with the help of the corporate news media. Now the movement has lost its original identity and more or less promotes the status quo that has failed us.
    This is because it is not a registered party and not owned by anyone, so whoever has the biggest voice (ie money) can have it.
  7. Subscriber Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    11 Oct '10 15:53
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    Surveys have pretty much established that self-declared Tea Party members are overwhelmingly conservative Republicans or Republican leaners who have voted for Republicans in the past. Moreover, the movement is primarily funded by a few billionaires and right wing foundations. It's not a "populist" movement by any stretch of the imagination.

    The article overrates its importance and support.
    You've nailed it. There's no reason you and the other 12 real progressives need worry.
  8. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    11 Oct '10 17:26
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    This is because it is not a registered party and not owned by anyone, so whoever has the biggest voice (ie money) can have it.
    The same is true about every grass roots movement.
  9. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    11 Oct '10 17:28
    Originally posted by no1marauder
    Surveys have pretty much established that self-declared Tea Party members are overwhelmingly conservative Republicans or Republican leaners who have voted for Republicans in the past. Moreover, the movement is primarily funded by a few billionaires and right wing foundations. It's not a "populist" movement by any stretch of the imagination.

    The article overrates its importance and support.
    The tea party must do well in the middle class or it would not have the clout it does.

    Dismissing the Tea Party as a few rich anti-government people is a mistake its detractors make at their peril.
  10. Subscriber Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    11 Oct '10 18:07 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    The tea party must do well in the middle class or it would not have the clout it does.

    Dismissing the Tea Party as a few rich anti-government people is a mistake its detractors make at their peril.
    Shhhhh.

    Actually here's the Tea Party explained about as well as I've seen it done. But pay it no mind. These right wing wackos are just astroturf racists who keep showing up because the Tea Party Union pays them to.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLD6VChcWCE&feature=player_embedded
  11. 11 Oct '10 18:20
    Originally posted by sh76

    If not, why do they support it?
    Because people in general simply join the club of their friends and family rather than thinking for themselves.
  12. Standard member adam warlock
    Baby Gauss
    11 Oct '10 18:29 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    The tea party must do well in the middle class or it would not have the clout it does.
    Actually I think that Chomsky has answered this question beautifully: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2zYaKXeyXE&feature=related
    But of course that reasoned and balanced analysis are to be ignored and/or vilified.

    Edit: Just look at the post above mine to see an example of a penetrating analysis of this movement and the reason for its existence...
  13. 11 Oct '10 18:33
    Originally posted by Sleepyguy
    Shhhhh.

    Actually here's the Tea Party explained about as well as I've seen it done. But pay it no mind. These right wing wackos are just astroturf racists who keep showing up because the Tea Party Union pays them to.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OLD6VChcWCE&feature=player_embedded
    whodey told me that was just more Republican lies. Likewise I visited the websites of the major Republican candidates who claim Tea Party support (the ones listed in another thread) and I saw almost no mention of the issues on which the Tea Party and the Republican Party differ. Other than the same old Republican lies what is different? Where are the actual Tea Party candidates. All I see are Republicans saying the same things Republicans have been saying for 30 years. What about the guy in Nevada who is running as the Tea Party candidate? Who are the actual Tea Party candidates in these other states?

    We've had a pretty good demonstration of Republican policies these last 30 years. Does anyone think it has been working? If the answer is that they are all liars and never enacted the those policies then why should I believe that Democratic policies are any different? Maybe the Democrats were liars and never enacted their policies. Isn't it insanity to keep doing the same thing expecting a different result? It could be we need completely different policies because in the past 30 years things have not gotten better in America. Does anyone believe that they have? If so, then why support the Tea Party?
  14. 11 Oct '10 19:29
    Tea party people probably do have republican/conservative leanings.....because those parties at least have given lip service to reduced government and lower spending. In practice this has not been true....but what has been the other option? Vote for a party that says they are going to spend more...tax more...and join with a party that is more concerned with providing entitlements than creating policies that develop self relience and reward for success.

    I don't believe we have had 30 years of republican rule....but if we have that is irrelavant to the tea party. This group is here today...not 5 years ago to hopefully bring in positive change that we is needed..... By classifying as republican/conservative you would brand it as the same old thing....lets hope its not.... If your against fiscally conservative people...say so and be proud to stand up and say" I want the government to grow larger and to be more involved in my life...i want entitlements to increase and more of my dollars should go to other people". If you can't do that...you should probably admit your are for the tea party
  15. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    11 Oct '10 19:46
    Originally posted by sh76
    The tea party must do well in the middle class or it would not have the clout it does.

    Dismissing the Tea Party as a few rich anti-government people is a mistake its detractors make at their peril.
    What "clout" do you think it has anywhere but in Republican primaries?