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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    04 Nov '10 12:56 / 1 edit
    ....greatest swing in a long time, but will fiscal conservatism and financial deregulation pressure guarentee a bigger crash by 2012, and if so will America be an OBAMANATION for the full 8 years.

    As in he'll have to charge in on his white horse, well on reserve and have to sell the whole bailout 2.0 once again.... which will finally beg the question, when will enough Americans finally believe that the country better finally adopt gentler social policies so that everyone has a decent chance of getting there together, not just those above 250k because if not enough get there the whole house of cards will just keep on falling down?
  2. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    04 Nov '10 12:58
    Originally posted by kmax87
    ....greatest swing in a long time, but will fiscal conservatism and financial deregulation pressure guarentee a bigger crash by 2012, and if so will America be an OBAMANATION for the full 8 years.

    As in he'll have to charge in on his white horse, well on reserve and have to sell the whole bailout 2.0 once again.... which will finally beg the question, whe ...[text shortened]... e 250k because if not enough get there the whole house of cards will just keep on falling down?
    It's going to fall down if Bernanke keeps throwing imaginary money around.
  3. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    04 Nov '10 13:00
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    It's going to fall down if Bernanke keeps throwing imaginary money around.
    When has money ever been anything more than the perception of its worth. The experts may say differently, but currency has a certain fundamental FIAT nature dont you think?
  4. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    04 Nov '10 13:03
    Originally posted by kmax87
    When has money ever been anything more than the perception of its worth. The experts may say differently, but currency has a certain fundamental FIAT nature dont you think?
    It needs to be based on something, wealth would be the ideal, but how could that be measured and who could be trusted. The current administration have proven they need their license to print revoked.
  5. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    04 Nov '10 13:10
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    It needs to be based on something, wealth would be the ideal, but how could that be measured and who could be trusted. The current administration have proven they need their license to print revoked.
    The pressure to request the fed to print is not just a DEMOCRAT disposition.
    Whenever it was that America worked out it was an empire with the whole world trading and holding its currency, administrations of every persuasion have let the ink run free
  6. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    04 Nov '10 13:18
    Originally posted by kmax87
    The pressure to request the fed to print is not just a DEMOCRAT disposition.
    Whenever it was that America worked out it was an empire with the whole world trading and holding its currency, administrations of every persuasion have let the ink run free
    In short the value of money these days seems a carrot and stick proposition, given that America with the most powerful armed force the world has ever seen, is willing to underwrite her position with her blood.
  7. 04 Nov '10 13:36
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    It needs to be based on something, wealth would be the ideal, but how could that be measured and who could be trusted. The current administration have proven they need their license to print revoked.
    The current administration is continuing the disastrous monetarist economic policies ever since Reagan began with it. Apparently it does not matter that even Friedman later admitted the policy had failed.
  8. 04 Nov '10 13:40
    Originally posted by kmax87
    ....greatest swing in a long time, but will fiscal conservatism and financial deregulation pressure guarentee a bigger crash by 2012, and if so will America be an OBAMANATION for the full 8 years.

    As in he'll have to charge in on his white horse, well on reserve and have to sell the whole bailout 2.0 once again.... which will finally beg the question, whe ...[text shortened]... e 250k because if not enough get there the whole house of cards will just keep on falling down?
    If the economy in 2012 is still in the shape that its in today, Obama will be running for re-election on a record of "four years of futility". It's hard to imagine any scenario in which he wins.

    But after a two year struggle between The Establishment vs The Tea Party, the GOP may well be a bedraggled mess. If the GOPs are business-as-usual (very few actual spending cuts), the Tea Party will treat them savagely. If the Tea Party pressure forces real cuts that impact real people (at a time when people are already struggling), there could be a lot of anger against the GOP.

    And maybe, the bad economy will finally give rise to the kind of energetic left-wing populist movement that has been largely absent from politics since the mid-1970's.

    All of this could lead to a couple of independent candidates to join Obama and whomever the GOP picks. One will be a non-partisan business owner ala Perot with a detailed plan for balancing the budget and reviving the economy. And one will be a Ralph Nader type progressive but unlike Nader, he will actually care about his campaign and attract votes.

    well...actually...this might be a scenario in which Obama might end up winning...with a total of 31% of the popular vote.
  9. 04 Nov '10 14:24
    yes this passal of new politicians need to come in and start screaming "lets get to cutting"...that is the way to them having success. I'm all for Obamas idea of not rehashing the last 2 years...lets get down to some real work and put this house in order.
  10. 04 Nov '10 15:51 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by kmax87
    ....greatest swing in a long time, but will fiscal conservatism and financial deregulation pressure guarentee a bigger crash by 2012, and if so will America be an OBAMANATION for the full 8 years.

    As in he'll have to charge in on his white horse, well on reserve and have to sell the whole bailout 2.0 once again.... which will finally beg the question, whe ...[text shortened]... e 250k because if not enough get there the whole house of cards will just keep on falling down?
    So on the one hand we need to spend on entitlements which are gentler on society but, on the other hand, these same entitlements seem to be leading to fiscal disaster and will stand society on its head?

    No doubt, when fiscal armageddon comes it will be the fault of corporate America even though the government's insane fiscal policies have undeniably lead us there.
  11. 04 Nov '10 16:55
    Originally posted by whodey
    So on the one hand we need to spend on entitlements which are gentler on society but, on the other hand, these same entitlements seem to be leading to fiscal disaster and will stand society on its head?

    No doubt, when fiscal armageddon comes it will be the fault of corporate America even though the government's insane fiscal policies have undeniably lead us there.
    I wonder under which president those insane fiscal policies started...
  12. 04 Nov '10 18:08
    we know debating the who started it leads nowhere. Lets talk about what to do...solutions matter...more than elections. The people have voted...they seem to want fiscal policies that make sense to them. Find ways of spending less and find ways of paying off the debt we have...just like in our homes
  13. 04 Nov '10 19:43
    Originally posted by highdraw
    we know debating the who started it leads nowhere. Lets talk about what to do...solutions matter...more than elections. The people have voted...they seem to want fiscal policies that make sense to them. Find ways of spending less and find ways of paying off the debt we have...just like in our homes
    In this case it leads to the cause of the current fiscal problems - reducing taxes without reducing spending in a fallacious assumption that supply side economics somehow makes any sense.
  14. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    04 Nov '10 23:00
    Originally posted by Melanerpes
    ...And maybe, the bad economy will finally give rise to the kind of energetic left-wing populist movement that has been largely absent from politics since the mid-1970's...All of this could lead to a couple of independent candidates to join Obama....well...actually...this might be a scenario in which Obama might end up winning...with a total of 31% of the popular vote.
    ...given that these midterms have culled the fiscally conservative blue dog liberals from the ranks, you have a point...As it stands the Democrats in Congress are probably more left than they've been for quite a while, and that might prove a critical mass for your scenario....