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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. 23 Jan '10 09:01
    Is health care reform dead? The possibility caused a rally in healthcare stocks.
    The Dems miscalculated by ignoring the voters on focusing on the economy.
    Now they are over-compensating by vilifying wall-street. News flash, voters weren't
    looking forward to replacing the private sector in health care with public sector
    controls. They may find the issue tricky, especially if they look to be overcompensating.
  2. 23 Jan '10 09:39
    Last time I checked, the U.S. health care system was a major burden on its economy.
  3. 23 Jan '10 10:20
    Last time I checked, the health care bill was going to increase the already-burdensome deficit and not bend the cost-curve, was going to raise taxes during a recession, and wasn't a priority that the public was even asking for.
  4. 23 Jan '10 10:54
    But surely, regardless of whether or not the current plan is any good, health care reform is needed to stop the costs spiralling out of control?
  5. Standard member monster truck
    Walleye Guy
    23 Jan '10 11:41
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    But surely, regardless of whether or not the current plan is any good, health care reform is needed to stop the costs spiralling out of control?
    100% correct.
    Spiralling is the perfect word as costs soar for both care and insurance.
    Identifying the cause of rising costs may be the first step in solving the problem.
  6. 23 Jan '10 14:10 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by monster truck
    100% correct.
    Spiralling is the perfect word as costs soar for both care and insurance.
    Identifying the cause of rising costs may be the first step in solving the problem.
    Cause of rising costs:

    Most people use insurance to cover their routine healthcare expenses. You need a new pair of eyeglasses? You need a dental cleaning? You need an antibiotic? No problem. No need to look for the best deal. Because Ol' Moneybags will pay for it.

    And Ol' Moneybags is laughing all the way to the bank. They've gotten you to buy insurance to pay for your groceries and your electric bill. It's all reward and no risk to them.

    Time to force Ol' Moneybags to insure ONLY the things they should be insuring. The catastrophic things that would threaten to bankrupt people. Those huge healthcare costs that people can't be expected to deal with themselves. But this kind of insurance is much less lucrative for Ol' Moneybags. Too bad.

    It's time to put an end to this racket once and for all. Everyone pays for their own routine healthcare, while we focus only on getting universal coverage for the really big costs.
  7. 23 Jan '10 14:56
    If you want to lower costs, then you have to attack it on all fronts.

    This means having only insurance with very high deductables. Insurance shouldn't be for office visits. If insurance is going to pay for it, the doctors can charge as much as they want, as well as taking the most expensive route. Money is no object if insurance is going to cover it. Most people don't understand, or unwilling to admit it, that the insurance vs medical costs just feed off each other and each is able to blame the other. Screw them. Force doctors to lower their rates by making people pay for things with cash.

    Next thing, do away with medical malpractice insurance. Cap damages and get the lawyer's finger out of the medical cash cow pie.
  8. 23 Jan '10 15:19
    Originally posted by Eladar
    If you want to lower costs, then you have to attack it on all fronts.

    This means having only insurance with very high deductables. Insurance shouldn't be for office visits. If insurance is going to pay for it, the doctors can charge as much as they want, as well as taking the most expensive route. Money is no object if insurance is going to cover it. M ...[text shortened]... practice insurance. Cap damages and get the lawyer's finger out of the medical cash cow pie.
    Why "cap" damages and not abolish them altogether? Is there any research that suggests punitive damages work?
  9. 23 Jan '10 15:26 / 1 edit
    Sure, do away with them all together. It is a nice idea that the person being wronged receive compensation, but in actuality it is only the person's lawyer and the doctor's lawayer that receive compensation. At the very least, capping would limit the amount of money the lawyers are sucking out of us.

    The costs involved for the doctor simply get passed along to us.
  10. 23 Jan '10 16:17 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by eljefejesus
    Is health care reform dead? The possibility caused a rally in healthcare stocks.
    The Dems miscalculated by ignoring the voters on focusing on the economy.
    Now they are over-compensating by vilifying wall-street. News flash, voters weren't
    looking forward to replacing the private sector in health care with public sector
    controls. They may find the issue tricky, especially if they look to be overcompensating.
    They wish to run our health care like they did Fanny and Freddie. Really what makes them angry is when the private sector makes money when what they should be doing is going further into debt into insolvency.

    As for health care, if the Republicans don't fix the current system headed for insolveny, then the Dems will be back pushing to nationalize the entier system.
  11. 23 Jan '10 17:25
    Originally posted by Eladar
    Sure, do away with them all together. It is a nice idea that the person being wronged receive compensation, but in actuality it is only the person's lawyer and the doctor's lawayer that receive compensation. At the very least, capping would limit the amount of money the lawyers are sucking out of us.

    The costs involved for the doctor simply get passed along to us.
    You can have compensation without punitive damages. The reason these damages are so high is that they are not only intended to compensate the victim, but also to punish the perpetrators.
  12. 23 Jan '10 17:40
    It doesn't punish anyone. All it does is force all doctors to get malpractice insurance so that if there is a judgement against them they don't have to pay it. The insurance company pays it, then all the other doctor's malpractice insurance rates go up, which means they increase their prices.

    There's no punishment at all. There is only a big cycle that sucks money out of the rest of us and gives it to insurance companies and lawyers.

    What a system.
  13. Standard member monster truck
    Walleye Guy
    23 Jan '10 21:30
    Originally posted by whodey
    They wish to run our health care like they did Fanny and Freddie. Really what makes them angry is when the private sector makes money when what they should be doing is going further into debt into insolvency.

    As for health care, if the Republicans don't fix the current system headed for insolveny, then the Dems will be back pushing to nationalize the entier system.
    Make no mistake, they want to run more than Mae, Mac, and Universal Healthcare.
    The core philosophy guiding them is nothing short of total control.
    Trans fats in NY are the perfect example.
    They believe that most folks are too stupid to make their own choices.


    They may be right.
  14. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    23 Jan '10 21:41
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    But surely, regardless of whether or not the current plan is any good, health care reform is needed to stop the costs spiralling out of control?
    Relax regulation in all aspects of health care.
  15. 23 Jan '10 21:51
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    Relax regulation in all aspects of health care.
    Do you have any empirical evidence that would suggest this would help?