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Debates Forum

  1. 18 Jun '10 02:39
    is he on the level?

    ----

    http://www.topix.net/forum/city/san-francisco-ca-chinatown/TMB3S2H8UBMFMIIR2

    Frontals, Glendora, CA

    May 1, 2010

    What part of "illegal" do the liberals not understand?
    Any other country in Europe mandates guestworkers to register and unregister in the cities they live in, or even legal citizens, for that matter, within 2 weeks. If not, you are jailed. It's as simple as that. I know. I lived there for a few years. All Arizona is asking for is to ask for papers. What in the h*** is going on in this country?
    The ACLU,(American Communist Lawyers Union) has dismantled our country into a third world spiral.
  2. 18 Jun '10 17:03
    Yeah it's weird how europeans are looking at the Arizona law and acting incredulous, claiming it's racist, when their laws are much more strict.
  3. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    18 Jun '10 18:12 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Sam The Sham
    Yeah it's weird how europeans are looking at the Arizona law and acting incredulous, claiming it's racist, when their laws are much more strict.
    Europeans are indigEnous to Europe. Different situation.
  4. 18 Jun '10 18:17
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    Europeans are indigEnous to Europe. Different situation.
    Yeah it's different in that they feel they have the right to control immigration into their countries but the US doesn't.
  5. 18 Jun '10 18:55
    While we're on that topic, why doesn't the US implement a federal civil registry of where everyone lives?
  6. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    18 Jun '10 19:05
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    While we're on that topic, why doesn't the US implement a federal civil registry of where everyone lives?
    I don't know the specifics, but Americans are a very rebellious, paranoid group. People from all ethnicities hide from the Man, living Off The Grid, as a perceived continuation of the ideals of individual liberty and rights. Whether the dude living Off The Grid is a Mexican, or a backwoods Anglo hermit, or an indigenous person, or a Hollywood liberal...they're from all walks of life. It's an American thing.

    It's kind of an attempt to avoid Orson Well's 1984.
  7. 18 Jun '10 19:14
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    Europeans are indigEnous to Europe. Different situation.
    yay, he got it right!
  8. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    18 Jun '10 19:15
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    yay, he got it right!
    Notice the edit
  9. 18 Jun '10 19:15
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    While we're on that topic, why doesn't the US implement a federal civil registry of where everyone lives?
    the closest we have are:

    State driver's license databases

    US Postal address databases

    any secret records the US govt may be holding on us
  10. 18 Jun '10 19:17
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    Notice the edit
    no matter! edits are allowed!

    does your browser underline misspellings in red?

    mine just underlined "mispellings" for me before i fixed it. it does it on another forum site so i guess it is not an RHP thing. i'm using Firefox.
  11. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    18 Jun '10 19:20
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    no matter! edits are allowed!

    does your browser underline misspellings in red?

    mine just underlined "mispellings" for me before i fixed it. it does it on another forum site so i guess it is not an RHP thing. i'm using Firefox.
    No, IE does not underline misspellings (is that the right spelling?)
  12. 18 Jun '10 19:21
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    I don't know the specifics, but Americans are a very rebellious, paranoid group. People from all ethnicities hide from the Man, living Off The Grid, as a perceived continuation of the ideals of individual liberty and rights. Whether the dude living Off The Grid is a Mexican, or a backwoods Anglo hermit, or an indigenous person, or a Hollywood libera ...[text shortened]... ks of life. It's an American thing.

    It's kind of an attempt to avoid Orson Well's 1984.
    Sure, but after some time of no 1984's happening, don't you have to reconsider? I mean, things like tax evasion become much more difficult with a civil registry, which means honest taxpayers will have to pay less taxes.
  13. 18 Jun '10 19:22
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    the closest we have are:

    State driver's license databases

    US Postal address databases

    any secret records the US govt may be holding on us
    and this stuff, which i hadn't heard about until i searched for it:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_ID#North_America

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identity_documents_in_the_United_States

    Passport Card, allowed to all citizens.

    Real ID law, which requires all states to bring their driver's licenses / state IDs into compliance with Federal regs. but it's controversial and around 17 to 25 states have passed laws requiring noncompliance.
  14. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    18 Jun '10 19:23 / 7 edits
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    Sure, but after some time of no 1984's happening, don't you have to reconsider? I mean, things like tax evasion become much more difficult with a civil registry, which means honest taxpayers will have to pay less taxes.
    Hey, I'm On The Grid. I'm explaining it, not trying to convince you that it's a good idea. However I do draw some comfort from this fact. They're the people who preserved literature in Fahrenheit 451.

    EDIT - Off The Grid people tend to be tax evaders precisely because they see taxes as a violation of their rights. Many of them are also great admirers of guerrilla warfare, whether they are on the Right or the Left. Many feel the US government is an immoral entity in it's current, powerful form (they're often strict Constitutionalists) and sympathize with Al Quaida, Communists, indiginous people etc. Many are Libertarians.

    Orson Scott Card implies his support of the right wing version of this movement in his rather silly novel Empire. Ron Paul is a typical hero of theirs.
  15. 18 Jun '10 19:26
    i typically only carry around a driver's license, and recently one of my credit cards has a photo of me on the back.

    non-drivers (or anyone, i guess) can get a State ID to use for ID purposes. drivers just use their driver's license for the same purpose. sometimes stores require photo ID (usually driver's license but could be a passport) when using checks or a credit card. state offices and passport offices may also require photo IDs.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Identity_documents_in_the_United_States

    Contents
    # 1 Birth certificate
    # 2 Social Security card
    # 3 Driver's license
    # 4 Passport
    # 5 Department of Defense Identification Card
    # 6 Other specialized cards

    ...
    Other specialized cards

    In the absence of a national identity card, the typical adult in the United States often carries a large number of documents issued by many different public and private entities.

    The U.S. Federal government issues the following types of identity documents:

    * Certificate of U.S. Citizenship
    * Certificate of Naturalization
    * Immigration and travel-related documents issued by the United States Citizenship and Immigration Services to non-U.S. citizens.
    * Passport
    * The passport card is a new travel document available to U.S. citizens for land and sea travel to Canada, Mexico, and various Caribbean destinations.
    * NEXUS card for travel between the United States and Canada.
    * SENTRI card for travel between the United States and Mexico.
    * The Transportation Worker Identification Credential, a new biometric security identification credential to be phased in by April 15, 2009, issued by the Transportation Security Administration.
    * The Merchant Mariner's Document, issued by the U.S. Coast Guard.

    Other documents that are evidence of an individual's identity:

    * State/territory driver's license (see above)
    * ID card issued by federal, state, or local government agencies or entities, provided it contains a photograph or information such as name, date of birth, gender, height, eye color and address
    * School ID card with photograph
    * Voter's registration card
    * Native American tribal document