Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Zugzwang
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    26 Aug '18 21:442 edits
    John McCain himself may have come to regret a part of his political legacy.
    He may bear some responsibility for the rise of Donald Trump.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/aug/26/john-mccain-sarah-palin-donald-trump

    "John McCain opened Pandora’s box – Sarah Palin came out, but Trump was right behind her "

    "Wednesday marks the 10th anniversary of McCain unveiling Sarah Palin,
    a say-anything, gun-toting political neophyte, as his running mate in the
    2008 presidential election. It was an act of political desperation that left
    Washington aghast. It delivered a short-term boost in the polls.
    But it also opened the Pandora’s box of populism.'

    "“I don’t think he [John McCain] could have known it at the time but he took a
    disease that was running through the Republican party – anti-intellectualism,
    disrespect for facts – and he put it right at the centre of the party,”
    --David Brooks

    "It is now easy to forget that in September 2008, McCain enjoyed a four-point
    lead over Barack Obama. Some analysts were sceptical that, given its tormented
    racial history, America would be willing to elect a black person to its highest office."

    Noam Chomsky predicted that John McCain would defeat Barack Obama in 2008.

    "McCain had spent the week “trying to portray Senator Barack Obama as
    a friend of terrorists who would drive the country into bankruptcy”, the paper
    [New York Times] notes, running campaign ads that hammered Obama as a “liar”."

    "Future historians seeking to understand the man and his time will surely revisit
    that day in Dayton, when McCain forced a smile and introduced “the next
    vice-president of the United States, Governor Sarah Palin of the great
    state of Alaska”. They will consider what it foretold, and ponder why a
    man of decency and honour opened the door to demagoguery in America"
  2. Subscribersonhouse
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    26 Aug '18 22:001 edit
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    John McCain himself may have come to regret a part of his political legacy.
    He may bear some responsibility for the rise of Donald Trump.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/aug/26/john-mccain-sarah-palin-donald-trump

    "John McCain opened Pandora’s box – Sarah Palin came out, but Trump was right behind her "

    "Wednesday marks the 10th anniver ...[text shortened]... oretold, and ponder why a
    man of decency and honour opened the door to demagoguery in America"
    For all you revile McCain (who freely admits he is not a saint) do you think he could POSSIBLY have been a worse POTUS than Trump had he been elected?

    YouTube

    This video clip kind of flies in the face of that piece you posted.
  3. Zugzwang
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    26 Aug '18 22:154 edits
    Originally posted by @sonhouse
    For all you revile McCain (who freely admits he is not a saint) do you think he could POSSIBLY have been a worse POTUS than Trump had he been elected?

    [youtube]3c-Ijky95dc[/youtube]

    This video clip kind of flies in the face of that piece you posted.
    The fatuous troll Sonhouse keeps showing his abysmal 'reading comprehension' (at best),
    jumping to another absurd conclusion, attacking another 'strawman'.

    I never wrote that I 'revile' John McCain or that he would have been a worse US President than Donald Trump.

    "The courage of your enemy honours you."
    --Sun Tzu

    I have considerable respect for John McCain as a comparatively honourable enemy.
    John McCain fought for US imperialism, which I (and many diverse people) oppose.

    I don't idolize John McCain like the flag-waving jingoistic American Sonhouse does.
    Sonhouse seems incapable of considering any more objective assessment of his hero.
  4. Joined
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    26 Aug '18 23:05
    McCain and his handlers failed to properly vet Palin. I have a feeling they felt she would be a good candidate due to her gender, her looks and her youth, which I'm guessing they felt would offset fears McCain looked old and decrepit next to Obama. She had never been in the news outside of Alaska, not a state that hits the front page as often as other states. And then she opened her mouth and all was lost. In my opinion, she probably cost McCain the presidency.
  5. Zugzwang
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    26 Aug '18 23:35
    Originally posted by @phranny
    McCain and his handlers failed to properly vet Palin. I have a feeling they felt she would be a good candidate due to her gender, her looks and her youth, which I'm guessing they felt would offset fears McCain looked old and decrepit next to Obama. She had never been in the news outside of Alaska, not a state that hits the front page as often as other stat ...[text shortened]... n she opened her mouth and all was lost. In my opinion, she probably cost McCain the presidency.
    It should not have been hard to discern that Sarah Palin was extremely unqualified to be President.
    If John McCain showed such poor judgment in choosing Sarah Palin as his Vice President,
    then why would President McCain not also choose poor judgment in appointing his Cabinet?
  6. Joined
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    27 Aug '18 00:53
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    It should not have been hard to discern that Sarah Palin was extremely unqualified to be President.
    If John McCain showed such poor judgment in choosing Sarah Palin as his Vice President,
    then why would President McCain not also choose poor judgment in appointing his Cabinet?
    I totally agree. I did NOT vote for McCain. However, I do think that she cost him the election.
  7. Subscribersonhouse
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    27 Aug '18 00:57
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    The fatuous troll Sonhouse keeps showing his abysmal 'reading comprehension' (at best),
    jumping to another absurd conclusion, attacking another 'strawman'.

    I never wrote that I 'revile' John McCain or that he would have been a worse US President than Donald Trump.

    "The courage of your enemy honours you."
    --Sun Tzu

    I have considerable respect ...[text shortened]... nhouse does.
    Sonhouse seems incapable of considering any more objective assessment of his hero.
    Comparatively honorable enemy. Honorable but still your enemy. That is a tell. Of course you have already indicated your hatred of the US so not a shocker.
  8. Subscribersonhouse
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    27 Aug '18 00:58
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    It should not have been hard to discern that Sarah Palin was extremely unqualified to be President.
    If John McCain showed such poor judgment in choosing Sarah Palin as his Vice President,
    then why would President McCain not also choose poor judgment in appointing his Cabinet?
    That might have cost him the presidency. If you remember she is the one who said she can see Russia from her porch...I guess she believes in the Flat Earth also. That would be one way you could see Russia from her house.
  9. Joined
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    27 Aug '18 01:46
    Originally posted by @phranny
    I totally agree. I did NOT vote for McCain. However, I do think that she cost him the election.
    Just to be clear, while I respect McCain, I would not have voted for him even if he had chosen a competent running mate.
  10. Subscribersonhouse
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    27 Aug '18 02:06
    Originally posted by @phranny
    Just to be clear, while I respect McCain, I would not have voted for him even if he had chosen a competent running mate.
    But he was the only senator who would work with democrats. That has to say something about the character of the man. None of his republican colleagues would even LOOK at a democrat much less work with one.
  11. Subscriberno1marauder
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    27 Aug '18 03:321 edit
    Originally posted by @phranny
    I totally agree. I did NOT vote for McCain. However, I do think that she cost him the election.
    That's exceedingly doubtful. Pundits like Dick Morris thought the move was brilliant at the time and McCain got a little bit more than the typical post-convention "bounce". He still led Obama slightly until mid-September. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/us/general_election_mccain_vs_obama-225.html

    Than Lehman Brothers went into bankruptcy and the enormity of the Wall Street financial collapse was quickly revealed. McCain who had campaigned on the coattails of the "strong economy" of President Bush never stood a chance after that. Palin was a minor, if not, a non-factor.
  12. Zugzwang
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    27 Aug '18 03:353 edits
    Originally posted by @sonhouse
    Comparatively honorable enemy. Honorable but still your enemy. That is a tell.
    Of course you have already indicated your hatred of the US so not a shocker.
    First of all, the obsessed lying troll Sonhouse refuses to concede that
    he made blatant false accusations against me in this thread.

    So Sonhouse evidently believes that the USA was right
    to fight its brutal war in Indochina and wanted the USA to win.
    Does the flag-waving jingoistic American Sonhouse concede
    that anyone at any time ever has been right to fight against the USA?

    I await Sonhouse, a fanatical apologist for US imperialism, condemning
    all criticism of the US My Lai Massacre as "anti-American" hatred.
  13. Zugzwang
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    27 Aug '18 03:401 edit
    Originally posted by @sonhouse to Phranny
    But he was the only senator who would work with democrats. That has to say something about the character of the man. None of his republican colleagues would even LOOK at a democrat much less work with one.
    It tv's FALSE that, during his career in the Senate, John McCain
    was the ONLY Republican willing to reach compromises
    with the Democrats.

    The troll Sonhouse is a boundless source of falsehoods and nonsense.
  14. Standard membershavixmir
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    27 Aug '18 04:37
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    John McCain himself may have come to regret a part of his political legacy.
    He may bear some responsibility for the rise of Donald Trump.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/aug/26/john-mccain-sarah-palin-donald-trump

    "John McCain opened Pandora’s box – Sarah Palin came out, but Trump was right behind her "

    "Wednesday marks the 10th anniver ...[text shortened]... oretold, and ponder why a
    man of decency and honour opened the door to demagoguery in America"
    Hahaha.
    Damn, that puts a whole new slant on the demise of Olympus.

    I bet even Zeus would have been surprised if Sarah Palin jumped out of the bloody jar.
  15. Stargazing
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    27 Aug '18 05:16
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    John McCain himself may have come to regret a part of his political legacy.
    He may bear some responsibility for the rise of Donald Trump.

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/aug/26/john-mccain-sarah-palin-donald-trump

    "John McCain opened Pandora’s box – Sarah Palin came out, but Trump was right behind her "

    "Wednesday marks the 10th anniver ...[text shortened]... oretold, and ponder why a
    man of decency and honour opened the door to demagoguery in America"
    Do you remember that time when we laughed and laughed at how you only ever read and quoted the Guardian?

    I said you should open your mind to other media sources and you howled with joy and laughter calling me a pathological lying racist troll over and over until we tumbled breathless into the long grass.
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