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  1. 06 Oct '17 15:41
    I watched Frontline's North Korea's deadly dictator. Although it was informative it brought up more questions than answers.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/

    The program says that the DPRK insists that it was not Kim Jong Nam that died at the airport and that it was Kim Chol (alleged alias). The program also said Nam's son was alive as shown on a video showing his passport, but no translated comments from him. Weird.
    Why have we never heard this until now? The USA corporate news media rarely even mentions that the DPRK denies being involved in the assassination. Now we hear this after all that time elapsed?

    Why does the corporate news media try so hard to not report the DPRK side of the story? If you think the DPRK side of it is so ridiculous, why doesn't the corporate news media jump for the chance to make the DPRK and Kim Jong Un look crazy and stupid? They tried so hard to convince people Un was a nutjob only to sit on the best comments to do just that? You would think they would be eager to tell everybody, yet they keep it arcane. Why?

    Kim Jong Un went to school in Switzerland and knows some English. Maybe his English is a bit poor, but he would still be a great interview. Why doesn't Charlie Rose or another reporter arrange for an interview with Un? Don't they like fantastic ratings? 60 Minutes doesn't like money? What's up with that?
  2. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    06 Oct '17 15:50
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    I watched Frontline's North Korea's deadly dictator. Although it was informative it brought up more questions than answers.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/

    The program says that the DPRK insists that it was not Kim Jong Nam that died at the airport and that it was Kim Chol (alleged alias). The program also said Nam's son was alive as shown on a ...[text shortened]... with Un? Don't they like fantastic ratings? 60 Minutes doesn't like money? What's up with that?
    I would have a problem with that. You could be going to a roach motel, you know, you can check in but you can't check out. If they thought it was politically expedient to hold a journalist I would think they would not hesitate to do it.
  3. Standard member vivify
    rain
    06 Oct '17 17:37
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    I watched Frontline's North Korea's deadly dictator. Although it was informative it brought up more questions than answers.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/

    The program says that the DPRK insists that it was not Kim Jong Nam that died at the airport and that it was Kim Chol (alleged alias). The program also said Nam's son was alive as shown on a ...[text shortened]... with Un? Don't they like fantastic ratings? 60 Minutes doesn't like money? What's up with that?
    Thanks for sharing this video.

    But what exactly do you mean by "North Korea's side"? What narrative do you feel U.S. media is leaving out?
  4. 06 Oct '17 23:06 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    I watched Frontline's North Korea's deadly dictator. Although it was informative it brought up more questions than answers.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/

    The program says that the DPRK insists that it was not Kim Jong Nam that died at the airport and that it was Kim Chol (alleged alias). The program also said Nam's son was alive as shown on a ...[text shortened]... with Un? Don't they like fantastic ratings? 60 Minutes doesn't like money? What's up with that?
    Even if he can speak some English, Kim Jong-un's not going to do an interview in English
    because the risk of him missing a linguistic nuance and being misunderstood is too dangerous.
    No one would advise him to navigate alone the diplomatic minefield of a foreign language.

    An American woman went to teach English in China. One day, she asked her students
    what they thought of Hitler. The students were reluctant to talk about politics at all,
    But eventually one student said (shyly), "Hitler was a great man." The teacher was horrified.
    She asked the other students if they agreed that 'Hitler was a great man' and they did.
    The American jumped to the absurd conclusion that all these Chinese children had been
    'brainwashed' into approving of Hitler's crimes! Why were all Chinese anti-Semitic racists?

    Upon further questioning, she discovered that the Chinese student had used the English
    word 'great' only in the sense of 'historically important' rather than 'morally exemplary'.
    All the Chinese students morally condemned Hitler. One of them said that Hitler had
    treated many other Europeans as brutally as Japan had treated them (Chinese).
    The American teacher privately had to concede that not many Americans would even
    know or object to Japan's many war crimes in China.
  5. 12 Oct '17 16:43
    Originally posted by @sonhouse
    I would have a problem with that. You could be going to a roach motel, you know, you can check in but you can't check out. If they thought it was politically expedient to hold a journalist I would think they would not hesitate to do it.
    Get real. Dennis Rodman goes in and out of the DPRK without fearof that. As long as Charlie Rose follows the rules he will be just fine. Besides, who said anything about having the interview in NK? Switzerland would work. China too. Open your mind and use some critical thinking skills.

    Charlie Rose interviewed Assad. He is still a free man. I'm sure Un would be eager to point out that the USA constantly harasses them and that his threats are a response to it. Rex Tillerson said the opposite was true which is a lie. Kim Jong Un would love nothing more than to set the record straight.
  6. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    12 Oct '17 16:57
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    Get real. Dennis Rodman goes in and out of the DPRK without fearof that. As long as Charlie Rose follows the rules he will be just fine. Besides, who said anything about having the interview in NK? Switzerland would work. China too. Open your mind and use some critical thinking skills.

    Charlie Rose interviewed Assad. He is still a free man. I'm sure ...[text shortened]... te was true which is a lie. Kim Jong Un would love nothing more than to set the record straight.
    Then there is that kid that went and came home in a coma. I know he screwed up trying to take a NK propaganda wall hanging and such but NK or SK is the last place I would want to visit. I spent a lot of time in Thailand and never felt threatened, except on time on a base caled Udorn a Cong came in shooting up the place with machine gun fire and I had to duck into a bunker, the Thai's dealt with him in short order and that was it for threats. No threats EVER from any Thai, military or civilian. Don't think I would do that in NK, especially going there for 3 years like I did in Thailand.
  7. 12 Oct '17 17:14
    Originally posted by @vivify
    Thanks for sharing this video.

    But what exactly do you mean by "North Korea's side"? What narrative do you feel U.S. media is leaving out?
    I'm sure Un would be eager to point out that the USA constantly harasses them and that his threats are a response to it. Rex Tillerson said the opposite was true which is a lie. Kim Jong Un would love nothing more than to set the record straight.

    I'm sure he would also like to point out that the USA killed 20% of North Koreans during the Korean war and used a lot of napalm on their people. He might also like to claim they did not start the Korean war as our side claims. Maybe he would like to blame the Japanese for killing Nam or whoever it was at the airport and ask for Japan to post the picture of the man the women claim to be Japanese and not North Korean as our country suggests. He could even be a Japanese American working for the CIA for all we know. Why has his picture not been shown on the news in this country, Japan, South Korea and all over the world in hopes of finding this murderer? Nobody in the USA seems to want to catch the master assassin that might have used these women and ruined their lives.
  8. 12 Oct '17 17:19
    Originally posted by @sonhouse
    Then there is that kid that went and came home in a coma. I know he screwed up trying to take a NK propaganda wall hanging and such but NK or SK is the last place I would want to visit. I spent a lot of time in Thailand and never felt threatened, except on time on a base caled Udorn a Cong came in shooting up the place with machine gun fire and I had to d ...[text shortened]... . Don't think I would do that in NK, especially going there for 3 years like I did in Thailand.
    Like I said, follow their rules.

    I would not go there either, but that is because they are so paranoid (for good reason) that Americans are there to spy. Dennis is not a suspected spy and Charlie Rose would be escorted by government officials. He would be in no danger unless a war broke out at the same time.
  9. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    12 Oct '17 17:52
    Originally posted by @metal-brain
    Like I said, follow their rules.

    I would not go there either, but that is because they are so paranoid (for good reason) that Americans are there to spy. Dennis is not a suspected spy and Charlie Rose would be escorted by government officials. He would be in no danger unless a war broke out at the same time.
    What reason would any American have to visit NK unless as an official state visit where one would presumably be somewhat protected.
  10. 12 Oct '17 18:05
    Originally posted by @sonhouse
    What reason would any American have to visit NK unless as an official state visit where one would presumably be somewhat protected.
    Ask Dennis Rodman.
  11. 12 Oct '17 19:25
    Originally posted by @sonhouse to Metal Brain
    Then there is that kid that went and came home in a coma. I know he screwed up trying to take a NK propaganda wall hanging and such but NK or SK is the last place I would want to visit. I spent a lot of time in Thailand and never felt threatened, except on time on a base caled Udorn a Cong came in shooting up the place with machine gun fire ...[text shortened]... . Don't think I would do that in NK, especially going there for 3 years like I did in Thailand.
    "Then there is that kid [Otto Warmbier] that went and came home in a coma."
    --Sonhouse

    'Kid'? Otto Warmbier was 21 years old (an adult in every US legal sense) when he was arrested in the DPRK.

    In an earlier thread, I wrote that, contrary to some Americans' claims (or stereotypical
    presumptions), I knew of no proof that Otto Warmbier was tortured in the DPRK.
    I also pointed out that it was against the DPRK's interest to have Otto Warmbier die.
    Most Americans seemed quick to assume that it must be true that Otto Warmiber was tortured.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/28/otto-warmbier-torture-north-korea-coroner

    "North Korea prisoner Otto Warmbier had no signs of torture – coroner:
    Parents and Donald Trump have said American student, who died days after release,
    was disfigured and had teeth ‘rearranged’ in detention."

    "A medical examiner has said that the body of Otto Warmbier, the American student who
    died days after being released from North Korea in a coma, displayed no obvious signs
    of torture, *despite claims* by his parents and President Donald Trump that he was
    physically abused following his arrest last year."

    "Fred and Cindy Warmbier told US TV networks on Tuesday that their son had showed
    signs of torture, including teeth that appeared to have been “rearranged” and hands
    and feet that were disfigured."

    But the medical examiner did *not* observe what the Warmbiers claim to have seen.

    "But Sammarco, who examined Warmbier’s body after his death in June, said there was no
    clear evidence of physical torture – including no recently broken bones or damaged teeth."

    "Warmbier’s body displayed a few small scars, all but one of which could be traced to
    medical instruments, she said, adding that the Warmbiers’ TV interviews had prompted
    her to publicly reveal her findings."

    "Warmbier’s parents had refused to allow an autopsy to be carried out."

    Otto Warmbier's parents 'refused to allow an autopsy' perhaps because they were afraid
    that its findings would *not* support their public claims that he was tortured in the DPRK.

    "Sammarco said she had conducted a “virtual autopsy” using extensive medical scanning
    and imaging, adding that a regular autopsy would have been of little use so long after
    Warmbier suffered brain damage. She said that his body was in surprisingly good
    condition for someone who had reportedly been bedridden for more than a year.
    Her office’s report said his body appeared “well-nourished”."

    US propaganda would like Americans to believe that Otto Warmbier was being starved in the DPRK.
  12. 12 Oct '17 19:31 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by @sonhouse to Metal Brain
    What reason would any American have to visit NK unless as an official state visit where one would presumably be somewhat protected.
    Some Americans may have more adventurous curiosity or independence of mind than Sonhouse.
    Some Americans may wish to form their own impressions of the DPRK after seeing it rather than,
    as Sonhouse likes to do, lap up US media propaganda demonizing various non-Westerners.

    Contrary to Sonhouse's evident paranoia, thousands (probably) of US citizens have visited,
    the DPRK and no more than a few have been detained for alleged crimes there.
    As far as I know, Otto Warmbier's the only American to die shortly after returning from the DPRK.

    Some visitors to the USA have died after experiencing alleged brutality by the American police.
    Would Sonhouse regard that as sufficient reason for foreigners to boycott tourism in the USA?

    I know that the DPRK has an appalling record of human rights abuses against its own people.
    But, as long as they behave themselves, foreign tourists seem to be reasonably safe in the DPRK.