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  1. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    19 Feb '16 20:52
    Is Alabama less racist? Much?

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/15/in-go-set-a-watchman-harper-lee-at-last-gives-us-a-believable-atticus-finch.html
  2. 19 Feb '16 21:57
    Much less
  3. 19 Feb '16 21:59 / 2 edits
    Well ,she is attributed with a quote I liked a lot:
    "The book to read is not the one which thinks for you, but the one which makes you think."
    Then she went and ruined it by saying it was the bible.
    Hell everybody knows it was Breakfast Of Champions.
    Followed closely by Tom Wolfe's Electric Kool-Aid Acid test.
    Then A Clockwork Orange.
    Them's the big three in my library.
  4. 19 Feb '16 22:25
    Originally posted by finnegan
    Is Alabama less racist? Much?

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/15/in-go-set-a-watchman-harper-lee-at-last-gives-us-a-believable-atticus-finch.html
    You have mentioned the word "racist " and you know what that means ?
    Duchess ..... yes she, or he cannot resist and will dually respond mark my words .
    The usual binge will spill out .." white American racist ,right wing illiterate blah,blah blah " .
  5. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    20 Feb '16 02:01 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by FishHead111
    Well ,she is attributed with a quote I liked a lot:
    "The book to read is not the one which thinks for you, but the one which makes you think."
    Then she went and ruined it by saying it was the bible.
    Hell everybody knows it was Breakfast Of Champions.
    Followed closely by Tom Wolfe's Electric Kool-Aid Acid test.
    Then A Clockwork Orange.
    Them's the big three in my library.
    You do realize that B of C is satire and Kurt Vonnegut wasn't really a racist, don't you?
  6. Standard member vivify
    rain
    20 Feb '16 16:33
    Originally posted by FishHead111
    Well ,she is attributed with a quote I liked a lot:
    "The book to read is not the one which thinks for you, but the one which makes you think."
    Then she went and ruined it by saying it was the bible.
    “People generally see what they look for, and hear what they listen for.”
    ---To Kill a Mockingbird.

    I guess she looked for ways to validate her beliefs.
  7. 20 Feb '16 21:22
    Originally posted by finnegan
    Is Alabama less racist? Much?

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/15/in-go-set-a-watchman-harper-lee-at-last-gives-us-a-believable-atticus-finch.html
    The truth is that in my visits to Alabama, I've found Michigan to show far more racial separation and tension, than Alabama.

    The truth is that wherever you are or go, you can find what you want to.
  8. 21 Feb '16 05:02 / 4 edits
    Originally posted by finnegan
    Is Alabama less racist? Much?

    http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/07/15/in-go-set-a-watchman-harper-lee-at-last-gives-us-a-believable-atticus-finch.html
    This is only impressionistic—based, in part, on the 25+ years I lived in the American South (as a transplant from the North).

    I remember being at a conference in Birmingham, where blacks and whites were staying at the same hotel, meeting together, eating in the same restaurants, etc. I remember walking the streets of Birmingham and thinking: “In my lifetime, a black person would have had to step off the sidewalk to make room for me to pass.”

    That’s just a vignette. But my sense is that the formal racism is less, and even the informal bigotry is less. “Much” less? I don’t know how to measure that in terms of subjective experience. I’d have to rely on statistical data.

    Less, of course, does not mean “dead”. I also knew people for whom the bigotry was still well alive—and those, for example, who only “objected” to those “uppity” blacks—that is, the ones who thought they were equal, and acted like it. But I also knew whites who were willing to confront their past bigotry, even if it was painful.

    So my “impressionistic” answer is (with respect to the South, not just Alabama): Less, but still very much alive.

    EDIT:

    One of my very best friends grew up in the deep south. He once related, very poignantly—for those who do not just dismiss personal history, conditioning and struggle against it—how he moved away from home and family because he could not live within the racist culture they adhered (or acquiesced) to. He still loved his family.

    It is one of the personal stories I have known in my life that leads me to distrust moral “purists” who, as often as not it seems (again: impressionistic), have not actually grappled with such things as the love of their family versus their own moral principles.
  9. 25 Feb '16 03:50
    Originally posted by vistesd
    This is only impressionistic—based, in part, on the 25+ years I lived in the American South (as a transplant from the North).

    I remember being at a conference in Birmingham, where blacks and whites were staying at the same hotel, meeting together, eating in the same restaurants, etc. I remember walking the streets of Birmingham and thinking: “In my lif ...[text shortened]... ctually grappled with such things as the love of their family versus their own moral principles.
    "That’s just a vignette. But my sense is that the formal racism is less, and even the informal bigotry is less. “Much” less? I don’t know how to measure that in terms of subjective experience."

    I never spent as much time as you did in the South, but I had much the same impression. Actually, I think there is far more anti black bigotry in many parts of the north, than in most of the South. Raised in Boston, I found there were both Italian and Irish terms for black folks, neither intended to be complimentary. Blacks in that metropolitan area, as in most, congregated in ghettos, as did the Irish and Italians, and other ethnic minorities. It is simply human nature to assemble with those most similar to you both in outward appearance, and in culture.

    Efforts to integrate neighborhoods via forced busing of school children, HUD relocations, and quotas all fail because of people's natural inclination to be with other similar people, not any conscious or unconscious racist motives.

    Some may have tried to move into integrated neighborhoods, and been disappointed in the cultural friction they encountered. Poor whites, and poor blacks have entirely different cultural norms, and cultural priorities. Not understanding this and attempting to force people together based entirely on economic status has caused even greater misunderstanding and racial tension than might have otherwise existed.

    Having a totally integrated and equal society is probably further away now than it was 50 years ago in the "civil rights" era. Guilt ridden white folks will try to accommodate blacks moving to their neighborhoods, but those often fail to "click" due to ingrained cultural differences which are usually blamed on the white people, and their failure to adjust.

    I don't know what the solution is, but I think it has to include large doses of patience as people adjust to one another, over decades of experience.