Please turn on javascript in your browser to play chess.
Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    17 Oct '13 15:18
    This is a question out of curiosity, not a challenge or an attack, so please view in that light.

    In today's day and age, do northern Irish Catholics (on average, of course, I realize they're not a homogeneous group) consider themselves loyal British citizens or still as an oppressed minority under occupation.

    For those that do consider themselves loyal Brits, is there a feeling of "let bygones be bygones for the strife of the 60s and 70s or is it more "we'll get our pound of flesh... all in good time"?
  2. Subscriber Sleepyguy
    Reepy Rastardly Guy
    17 Oct '13 15:22 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    This is a question out of curiosity, not a challenge or an attack, so please view in that light.

    In today's day and age, do northern Irish Catholics (on average, of course, I realize they're not a homogeneous group) consider themselves loyal British citizens or still as an oppressed minority under occupation.

    For those that do consider themselves loyal Br ...[text shortened]... the strife of the 60s and 70s or is it more "we'll get our pound of flesh... all in good time"?
    I think you're just trying to get no1 back on the hook
  3. Standard member bill718
    Enigma
    17 Oct '13 15:23
    Originally posted by sh76
    This is a question out of curiosity, not a challenge or an attack, so please view in that light.

    In today's day and age, do northern Irish Catholics (on average, of course, I realize they're not a homogeneous group) consider themselves loyal British citizens or still as an oppressed minority under occupation.

    For those that do consider themselves loyal Br ...[text shortened]... the strife of the 60s and 70s or is it more "we'll get our pound of flesh... all in good time"?
    I watched a TV special on this subject last year. It seems there is some simmering anger by many Irish Catholics, but the situation has calmed down a bit in the last 10 yrs.
  4. 17 Oct '13 15:30
    Originally posted by sh76
    This is a question out of curiosity, not a challenge or an attack, so please view in that light.

    In today's day and age, do northern Irish Catholics (on average, of course, I realize they're not a homogeneous group) consider themselves loyal British citizens or still as an oppressed minority under occupation.

    For those that do consider themselves loyal Br ...[text shortened]... the strife of the 60s and 70s or is it more "we'll get our pound of flesh... all in good time"?
    Not being either Irish or Catholic, I suspect there is a similarity to the situation in the Southern States. There may be a residual resentment of the Northern conquest, but many just are getting on with life as it is now.
  5. 17 Oct '13 15:38 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    In today's day and age, do northern Irish Catholics (on average, of course, I realize they're not a homogeneous group) consider themselves loyal British citizens or still as an oppressed minority under occupation.
    According to the Wikipedia entry on the subject, "In the 2009 survey by Northern Ireland Life and Times, 47% of Northern Irish Catholics supported Northern Ireland remaining a part of the United Kingdom, either by direct rule (8% ) or devolved government (39% )."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Ireland
  6. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    17 Oct '13 16:06
    The Protestants have been rioting up there this year.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/14/world/europe/dozens-injured-in-northern-ireland-as-protestants-riot-over-blocked-parade-route.html?_r=0
  7. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    17 Oct '13 16:16 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Not being either Irish or Catholic, I suspect there is a similarity to the situation in the Southern States. There may be a residual resentment of the Northern conquest, but many just are getting on with life as it is now.
    There are riots evey year. The Orange Order is really aggressive and disrespectful.

    Some "bad" words - Go on Home British Soldiers
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rgRg6j8mQo

    For eight hundred years
    We've fought you without fear
    and we will fight you for eight
    hundred more

    We're not British, we're not Saxon, we're not English
    We're Irish
    and proud we are to be!
  8. 17 Oct '13 16:34
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    There are riots evey year. The Orange Order is really aggressive and disrespectful.

    Some "bad" words - Go on Home British Soldiers
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rgRg6j8mQo

    For eight hundred years
    We've fought you without fear
    and we will fight you for eight
    hundred more

    We're not British, we're not Saxon, we're not English
    We're Irish
    and proud we are to be!
    Did you happen to notice that the video was uploaded March of 2007, a bit dated.

    I don't doubt that some of that sentiment remains, and actually the Southern US sentiment is very often where the population was originally Scot/Irish known in this hemisphere to be intemperent and given to excessive pugilism.
  9. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    17 Oct '13 16:40
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Did you happen to notice that the video was uploaded March of 2007, a bit dated.

    I don't doubt that some of that sentiment remains, and actually the Southern US sentiment is very often where the population was originally Scot/Irish known in this hemisphere to be intemperent and given to excessive pugilism.
    It's a song, not a news article. That song is a lot older than 2007. But there were riots a few months ago. Every summer there are riots up there.

    The Scots-Irish are Protestant imperialists.
  10. 18 Oct '13 03:21
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    It's a song, not a news article. That song is a lot older than 2007. But there were riots a few months ago. Every summer there are riots up there.

    The Scots-Irish are Protestant imperialists.
    So do you think the IRA will begin terrorist bombings again soon?
  11. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    18 Oct '13 04:34
    Originally posted by normbenign
    So do you think the IRA will begin terrorist bombings again soon?
    Don't know. Probably not, unless the British Army kills some more Irish.
  12. Standard member wolfgang59
    Infidel
    18 Oct '13 06:12 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by sh76
    This is a question out of curiosity, not a challenge
    or an attack, so please view in that light.

    In today's day and age, do northern Irish Catholics
    (on average, of course, I realize they're not a homogeneous group) consider themselves loyal British citizens or still as an
    oppressed minority under occupation.

    For those that do consider themselves lo ...[text shortened]... the strife of the 60s and 70s or is it more "we'll get our pound of flesh... all in good time"?
    My data (4 Irish Catholics in London) suggests that they would rather
    be part of a United Ireland but its no big deal. Most people are realists
    and just get on with it. EU is the way to go!

    My friends suggest that it is the working (not-working?) classes of
    Catholics and Protestants that are the most discontent
    (and easily manipulated by politicians)
  13. Standard member wolfgang59
    Infidel
    18 Oct '13 06:13 / 1 edit
    So in answer to the question; today's northern Irish Catholics do
    not consider themselves loyal British citizens nor an oppressed minority.
  14. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    18 Oct '13 14:54
    Originally posted by Sleepyguy
    I think you're just trying to get no1 back on the hook
    Either that or just steer the conversation away from the same old broken record of "Obama is this" and "the Tea Party is that."
  15. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    18 Oct '13 14:57
    Originally posted by normbenign
    Not being either Irish or Catholic, I suspect there is a similarity to the situation in the Southern States. There may be a residual resentment of the Northern conquest, but many just are getting on with life as it is now.
    The Civil War was 150 years ago. The bloody strife between the Irish Catholics and the British occupiers* is just a couple of decades removed from being quite bloody.




    * If that doesn't get no1 into this thread, nothing will.