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  1. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    30 Nov '09 01:47
    Here are the last three paragraphs from last week's Lexington column in The Economist:

    [Sarah Palin] had a few days to cram for a hazing most [Vice-Presidential] candidates spend years preparing for. She flunked, badly. Two-thirds of Americans now say she is unqualified to be president. A YouGov poll for The Economist this week found that 52% disapprove of her, of whom 40% do so strongly. And some of her critics express themselves rather forcefully. Naomi Wolf, a feminist, calls her “a stalking horse [for] the coming police state”. Al Gore’s TV channel calls her a “gun-ho”. Mrs Palin recalls her young daughter looking out of a car window and seeing people wearing T-shirts that said, simply: “Sarah Palin is a ****”. Such rudeness outrages Mrs Palin’s supporters—and makes them love her more.

    On policy, Mrs Palin’s book is negligible. Her call for “commonsense conservatism” is a string of clichés. She favours free markets and a robust defence, but other than that she offers few specifics about how she would grapple with the big problems America actually faces. She sometimes says things that make no sense: whatever its flaws, cap-and-trade is not a Ponzi scheme. One could argue that none of this matters. Mrs Palin will never be president—no one so widely disliked can plausibly win a general election. But should she decide to run in 2012, she would hit the Republican primaries like an avalanche. Some pundits think she could capture the nomination.

    In many states, Republican primaries, unlike Democratic ones, are winner-takes-all. That is, when there are several people on the ballot, one of them can scoop all the delegates with only a modest plurality of the vote. This system sounds tailor-made for Mrs Palin. As Walter Shapiro of Politics Daily puts it: “A well-known candidate with a passionate following who organises early can win the nomination even if a large swathe of the party believes that he or she is ill-equipped to be entrusted with the nation’s nuclear codes.” Nothing would please the Democrats more.

    http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14915160


    Any thoughts on the bits I have highlighted?

    More recent Palinology from The Economist: "http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14895196"
  2. 30 Nov '09 02:08
    Originally posted by FMF
    Here are the last three paragraphs from last week's [b]Lexington column in The Economist:

    [quote][Sarah Palin] had a few days to cram for a hazing most [Vice-Presidential] candidates spend years preparing for. She flunked, badly. Two-thirds of Americans now say she is unqualified to be president. A YouGov poll for The Economist this week found that 52% di ...[text shortened]... onomist: "http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=14895196"[/i][/b]
    Sarah Palin memoir tops US bestseller chart


    "A string of public appearances have helped to boost Palin's book sales
    Former US vice-presidential candidate Sarah Palin's memoir has topped the US bestseller list in its first week of release, industry figures have shown.
    With almost half a million copies sold, Going Rogue: An American Life beat new blockbusters by James Patterson and Stephen King Nielsen BookScan said.
    Her sales have topped those of Barack Obama, whose Audacity of Hope sold 67,000 copies in its first week."


    Look at your sources FMF. Her book sales alone show there is big support in this country for real change. Unlike Obamas lip service.
    Personally, I dont think Palin has what it takes to be pres. But her message strikes a chord with many americans
  3. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    30 Nov '09 02:22 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by utherpendragon
    Look at your sources FMF. Her book sales alone show there is big support in this country for real change. [...] But her message strikes a chord with many americans
    That's exactly what my sources say. So I am not sure what you mean.

    She strikes a chord with many Americans but if she does this with "a string of clichés", what does it really mean for the future?

    What is "real change"? How can her book be about "real change" if "she offers few specifics about how she would grapple with the big problems America actually faces."

    If she "hit the Republican primaries like an avalanche" - more reference to her undoubted popularity - would it maybe gift the election to the Democratic Party?

    As one of the few supporters (among regular posters) that she has on this forum, it would be interesting to hear you engage the assertions in the above article and address political realities, rather than cop out with book sales figures.

    For instance, Lexington says: "...no one so widely disliked can plausibly win a general election." Is that true do you think?
  4. 30 Nov '09 02:41
    It's the image. If I can take a Tom Waits liberty:

    She's a-hot and ready, creamy and sugared
    And the band is awful and so are the tunes
  5. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    30 Nov '09 02:48
    Originally posted by badmoon
    She's a-hot and ready, creamy and sugared
    And the band is awful and so are the tunes
    "Big support" for clichés - including some "things that make no sense"- which "strike a chord" and sells books to angry people - is not especially healthy for the Republicans, and for America in general. It hasn't gone particularly well for Obama and the Demoratic Party, either.
  6. 30 Nov '09 05:49
    Originally posted by FMF
    That's exactly what my sources say. So I am not sure what you mean.

    She strikes a chord with many Americans but if she does this with "a string of clichés", what does it really mean for the future?

    What is "real change"? How can her book be about "real change" if "she offers few specifics about how she would grapple with the big problems America actually f ...[text shortened]... o widely disliked can plausibly win a general election." Is that true do you think?
    For instance, Lexington says: "...no one so widely disliked can plausibly win a general election." Is that true do you think?

    This I believe is correct. The left views her as such a threat they have demonized her relentlessly.
    She is liked very much by the masses but the media has succeeded in portraying her in such a way that many people do not take her seriously enough.
  7. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    30 Nov '09 06:05 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by utherpendragon
    The left views her as such a threat they have demonized her relentlessly.
    So you think the article is wrong when it says she'd be a shoo in for the Primaries and then would hand the general election to the Democrat?

    I'm not sure that she is seen as a threat by the "left". I think they welcome her candidacy, in fact.

    As for the media's 'version' of her, I think if whe was a potential stateswoman of substance, her stature and political intelligence would shine through anyway.
  8. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    30 Nov '09 15:57
    Originally posted by FMF
    So you think the article is wrong when it says she'd be a shoo in for the Primaries and then would hand the general election to the Democrat?

    I'm not sure that she is seen as a threat by the "left". I think they welcome her candidacy, in fact.

    As for the media's 'version' of her, I think if whe was a potential stateswoman of substance, her stature and political intelligence would shine through anyway.
    I don't think she will win the 2012 nomination, though I agree that the winner take all system favors her. By the time the field is down to 2 or 3, maybe she has enough delegates to overcome the fact that she probably couldn't beat another serious candidate head to head.

    I do think she would almost certainly lose a general election.

    Best case scenario:

    1) By 2010, many moderates have moved back into the GOP camp

    2) Palin cleans up on the conservative end, pushing out the Huckabees of the World.

    3) A moderate like Bill Crist emerges in the non-Palin wing of the party. The nomination comes down to Palin-Crist (or something to that effect).
  9. 30 Nov '09 17:35
    I think Obama would love to see Palin run for President in 2012.
  10. 30 Nov '09 17:50
    Originally posted by utherpendragon
    [b]For instance, Lexington says: "...no one so widely disliked can plausibly win a general election." Is that true do you think?

    This I believe is correct. The left views her as such a threat they have demonized her relentlessly.
    She is liked very much by the masses but the media has succeeded in portraying her in such a way that many people do not take her seriously enough.[/b]
    The left views her as such a threat they have demonized her relentlessly.

    if anything the left sees her as a blessing, as for the "demonizing" it isn't something very hard to do, after all, the stuff she says is enough to label her a loon.

    She is liked very much by the masses

    cheap populism, I've seen it before.

    the media has succeeded in portraying her in such a way that many people do not take her seriously enough.

    Its not the media, its her, she is responsible for making herself look stupid, not the media.
  11. Donation mwmiller
    RHP Member No.16
    30 Nov '09 17:51
    Before anyone puts her on the ballot, why not take a look at her record and experience so far, and then explain what they see that would qualify her for any public office.

    Here's what I see:

    Wasilla City council, 92-96 (4 years).
    Wasilla Mayor, 96-03 (7 years).
    unsuccessful bid for Lt. Governor of Alaska in 2002.
    Alaska Gas and Oil Commission, 03-04 (resigned).
    Governor or Alaska, 06-09 (resigned).

    By the way, the population of Wasilla is less than 6000 people, and the population of the state of Alaska is under 1 million people.

    Did I miss something here?
    If she has some qualification that I missed please feel free to jump in and add it to her resume.
  12. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    30 Nov '09 18:02
    Originally posted by mwmiller
    If she has some qualification that I missed please feel free to jump in and add it to her resume.
    She wants “commonsense conservatism” and favours free markets and a robust defence. This has struck a chord with people. And she wrote a book.
  13. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    30 Nov '09 18:41 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by mwmiller
    Before anyone puts her on the ballot, why not take a look at her record and experience so far, and then explain what they see that would qualify her for any public office.

    Here's what I see:

    Wasilla City council, 92-96 (4 years).
    Wasilla Mayor, 96-03 (7 years).
    unsuccessful bid for Lt. Governor of Alaska in 2002.
    Alaska Gas and Oil Commission, 0 ...[text shortened]... she has some qualification that I missed please feel free to jump in and add it to her resume.
    I'm not interested in seeing Palin win the nomination either.

    But, since when are "qualifications" such a big issue?

    Those "qualifications" aren't much. But are they really any worse than seven years as a state legislator and a couple of years as a US Senator? Those seem to have been sufficient "qualifications" for the Presidency.

    At least mayor and governor are executive positions. How is a shorter amount of time as a legislator superior to Palin's experience?

    She's at least as "qualified" as Obama was.

    Of course, the truth is that the only "qualifications" there are to being President are being born in the US, being 35 years old and being elected President.
  14. Standard member telerion
    True X X Xian
    30 Nov '09 21:01 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by utherpendragon
    Sarah Palin memoir tops US bestseller chart


    "A string of public appearances have helped to boost Palin's book sales
    Former US vice-presidential candidate Sarah Palin's memoir has topped the US bestseller list in its first week of release, industry figures have shown.
    With almost half a million copies sold, Going Rogue: An American Life beat ...[text shortened]... Palin has what it takes to be pres. But her message strikes a chord with many americans
    This argument is much like that saying that FoxNews is more mainstream because it has more viewership than other news channels and it suffers from the same problem. Specifically, you need evidence which would rule out the possibility that these book sales are coming from a large, passionate minority of Americans. My suspicion is that this is actually what is going on (same with FoxNews).

    Personally, I hope Palin doesn't make it out I'd the primaries, if only for the reason that I'd like to have a choice to consider when I vote in '10.
  15. Subscriber kmax87
    You've got Kevin
    30 Nov '09 21:44
    Originally posted by telerion
    Specifically, you need evidence which would rule out the possibility that these book sales are coming from a large, passionate minority of Americans. My suspicion is that this is actually what is going on (same with FoxNews).
    What's the adult book buying population of America anyway? Did the opening sales even represent a half a million people, or is it a bit like the music biz where you go to no 1 in the charts on the back of retailers having bought your product, which looks great in terms of additional promotional advertising(this *_insert media product, has gone to the top of the *_insert popularity benchmark reference).

    But then the flavor of the month finds that when the product cant move off the shelves they are heavily in debt to the publisher/record company because the advances already paid were based on projected sales off the back which determined the size of the initial print run[s]/pressings.