Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. SubscriberKewpie
    since 1-Feb-07
    Joined
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    22 May '18 08:231 edit
    The community tires of seeing families destroyed by the road toll. So the community passes legislation outlawing drink-driving and texting, mandating airbags and seatbelt use, and funding improvements to highway design. Some folk may have objected to all that reduction of their civil rights, but eventually the common sense of the "herd" prevailed.

    The community tires of seeing families destroyed by school shootings. So the community passes legislation controlling the ownership of guns and mandating gun security. Some folk may have objected to that reduction of their civil rights, but eventually ..................... unless a powerful lobby group buys off the decision makers.

    Move along, nothing to see here.

    {edited for typo}
  2. Joined
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    22 May '18 08:48
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    "Who the fuk cares about the shooter's motives..."
    --Zahlanzi

    Attempting to understand the motives does NOT mean excusing the crimes.
    Yet it can distract from the real issue.
    There is a bigger problem that needs the entirety of the attention of a country that treats owning guns like a religion and is known for short attention span.
  3. Joined
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    22 May '18 08:50
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    The troll No1Marauder apparently hates me more than he professes to oppose Israel's oppression of the Palestinians.

    "Most American politicians, like most Americans period, support an equitable, two State solution."
    --No1Marauder

    As an ignorant ethnocentric American (who apparently wants to believe that the USA has
    been consistently 'even-handed' ...[text shortened]... s to my usual trolls for 'thumbing down' this post in less time than would be needed to read it.
    But yes, you are right, your fight with marauder over who is right on the palestinian crisis is totally relevant to mass shootings in the US
  4. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    2120
    23 May '18 21:002 edits
    Originally posted by @zahlanzi
    Yet it can distract from the real issue.
    There is a bigger problem that needs the entirety of the attention of a country that
    treats owning guns like a religion and is known for short attention span.
    "There is a bigger problem that needs the entirety of the attention of a country [USA]
    that treats owning guns like a religion and is known for short attention span."
    --Zahlanzi

    That's a problem for the Americans, many of whom here love to claim sneeringly that I
    can understand nothing about them. So why should it be any particular concern of mine?
    Many of these proud Americans presumably would love to claim that I criticize gun violence
    in the USA ONLY because I must be extremely ignorant and deluded about everything American.
    So let these Americans deal with their own problem, if they are even willing to admit that it exists.

    Proud Americans love to boast that the USA has the world's best system of government.
    American gun violence is a foreseeable consequence of most Americans--at least of
    most American politicians elected by most Americans--getting exactly what they want.
    Americans have every right to value their 'gun freedom' above their children's lives.
    So Americans should not blame others (a foreign conspiracy, eh?) when the painful
    consequences of their free democratic choices hit are made clearer to them.

    While I have sympathy for individual victims of American gun violence, I have none for the USA as a whole.
    The American people freely elected all the politicians who put into place their laws about guns.
    If most Americans were truly disturbed (actions speak louder than words) by gun violence,
    then they would vote all politicians who opposed stricter gun control out of office.

    But it's always been easier for most Americans to point their fingers at blame at others
    rather than take responsibility for the manifest failures of their society. There's no foreign
    dictatorship imposing 'gun freedom' and 'gun culture' upon the 'all wise' American people.
    In general, the American people are getting what they deserve with American gun violence.
    It's up to them to decide when they have become sickened enough to decide to change it.
  5. SubscriberWOLFE63
    Tra il dire e il far
    C'e di mezzo il mar!
    Joined
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    23 May '18 21:10
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    "There is a bigger problem that needs the entirety of the attention of a country [USA]
    that treats owning guns like a religion and is known for short attention span."
    --Zahlanzi

    That's a problem for the Americans, many of whom here love to claim sneeringly that I
    can understand nothing about them. So why should it be any particular concern of min ...[text shortened]... olence.
    It's up to them to decide when they have become sickened enough to decide to change it.
    If sheep are lead across a flooding river by an evil or negligent shepherd...is it the flock's fault?

    A truly caring guide would get the flock out of there.
  6. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    23 May '18 21:253 edits
    Originally posted by @wolfe63
    If sheep are lead across a flooding river by an evil or negligent shepherd...is it the flock's fault?
    A truly caring guide would get the flock out of there.
    Did the majority of sheep vote in free democratic elections to have the shepherd lead them?

    Wolfe63 apparently wants to argue that the American people are as helpless as a flock of sheep.
    Again, Americans prefer to blame others and evade responsibility for their own free choices.
  7. Joined
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    24 May '18 08:22
    Originally posted by @wolfe63
    If sheep are lead across a flooding river by an evil or negligent shepherd...is it the flock's fault?

    A truly caring guide would get the flock out of there.
    can the sheep vote the shepherd out of office?
    then yes, it's the sheep's fault. it's the sheep's responsibility to vote the shepherd out

    "A truly caring guide would get the flock out of there"
    and you can't get a truly caring guide until a truly caring sheep stops being a sheep and becomes a shepherd. that means work though.
  8. SubscriberWOLFE63
    Tra il dire e il far
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    24 May '18 13:28
    Originally posted by @zahlanzi
    can the sheep vote the shepherd out of office?
    then yes, it's the sheep's fault. it's the sheep's responsibility to vote the shepherd out

    "A truly caring guide would get the flock out of there"
    and you can't get a truly caring guide until a truly caring sheep stops being a sheep and becomes a shepherd. that means work though.
    Poorly fed sheep, grazing upon non-nourishing grasses, can hardly qualify as shepherds.

    Worse, all around the flock are hungry wolves...telling lies, misleading the weaklings...all in order to secure lifetime supplies of mutton.:'(
  9. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    24 May '18 18:152 edits
    Originally posted by @wolfe63 to Zahlanzi
    Poorly fed sheep, grazing upon non-nourishing grasses, can hardly qualify as shepherds.

    Worse, all around the flock are hungry wolves...telling lies, misleading the weaklings...all in order to secure lifetime supplies of mutton.:'(
    Contrary to Wolfe63's absurd analogy, this issue's not about sheep, it's about people.
    It's about the American people and their democratically elected leaders (who flatter them).
    Would Wolfe63 insist that the American people are as helpless as a flock of sheep?
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