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  1. 10 Jun '16 21:44
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/white-south-african-estate-agent-fined-racist-facebook-post-penny-sparrow-hate-speech

    A South African court has found Penny Sparrow (a white woman) guilty
    of hate speech and fined her approximately 10,000 USD for her Facebook
    post that compared black people littering on the beach to monkeys.

    Should Penny Sparrow have been convicted and punished?
  2. 10 Jun '16 22:14
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/white-south-african-estate-agent-fined-racist-facebook-post-penny-sparrow-hate-speech

    A South African court has found Penny Sparrow (a white woman) guilty
    of hate speech and fined her approximately 10,000 USD for her Facebook
    post that compared black people littering on the beach to monkeys.

    Should Penny Sparrow have been convicted and punished?
    Yet the Blacks get mobs going holding signs and chanting things about killing whites. I wonder if they get a greater fine?
  3. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    11 Jun '16 11:40
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/white-south-african-estate-agent-fined-racist-facebook-post-penny-sparrow-hate-speech

    A South African court has found Penny Sparrow (a white woman) guilty
    of hate speech and fined her approximately 10,000 USD for her Facebook
    post that compared black people littering on the beach to monkeys.

    Should Penny Sparrow have been convicted and punished?
    No.
  4. Subscriber Suzianne
    Misfit Queen
    11 Jun '16 11:59
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/white-south-african-estate-agent-fined-racist-facebook-post-penny-sparrow-hate-speech

    A South African court has found Penny Sparrow (a white woman) guilty
    of hate speech and fined her approximately 10,000 USD for her Facebook
    post that compared black people littering on the beach to monkeys.

    Should Penny Sparrow have been convicted and punished?
    It's difficult to opine about whether it was hate speech or not without the text of her post.
  5. 11 Jun '16 15:48 / 2 edits
    Pretty much illegal to say something bad about negroes anywhere nowadays but it's just fine for them to say anything they want about white people.
    Celebrate diversity.
  6. 11 Jun '16 16:49
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/10/white-south-african-estate-agent-fined-racist-facebook-post-penny-sparrow-hate-speech

    A South African court has found Penny Sparrow (a white woman) guilty
    of hate speech and fined her approximately 10,000 USD for her Facebook
    post that compared black people littering on the beach to monkeys.

    Should Penny Sparrow have been convicted and punished?
    The women is probably an idiot. But Facebook is a place for exchanging ideas and I wouldn't fine her for racist speech and I wouldn't fine you for your racist speech either.
  7. 11 Jun '16 20:02
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    It's difficult to opine about whether it was hate speech or not without the text of her post.
    It took me a few seconds to look up Penny Sparrow's Facebook post on the internet:
    (I have made no corrections of her grammar, punctuation, or spelling.)

    "These monkeys that are allowed to be released on New years Eve And new years day
    on to public beaches towns etc obviously have no education what so ever so to allow
    them loose is inviting huge dirt and troubles and discomfort to others. I'm sorry to say
    I was amongst the revellers and I saw were black on black skins what a shame.
    I do know some wonderful thoughtful black people. This lot of monkeys just don't want
    even to try. But think they can voice opinions about statute and get their way dear oh dear.
    from now I Shall address the blacks of south Africa as monkeys as I see the cute little
    wild monkeys do the same pick drop and litter."
    --originally posted by Penny Sparrow on Facebook

    1) Her post seems motivated by her observations of by some black people on a public beach.
    2) She claims to know 'some wonderful thoughtful black people'.
    3) But she still lumps all 'the blacks of South Africa' together as 'monkeys'.
    4) She seems upset that black people with 'obviously no education' (in her opinion)
    have political rights and can 'get their way' (unlike during the apartheid period).

    What *may* be relevant (I don't know) is the fact that many poor black people don't
    have indoor flush toilets, and so they may be accustomed to different sanitary practices.

    Penny Sparrow's post seems full of racist stereotypes and the resentment toward the
    newly empowered black majority that's felt by many white South Africans after apartheid.
    Would any of the 'wonderful thoughtful black people' who Penny Sparrow claims to know
    be willing to attest that she usually does not show any overt racism toward them?
  8. 11 Jun '16 20:05 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by quackquack
    The women is probably an idiot. But Facebook is a place for exchanging ideas and I
    wouldn't fine her for racist speech and I wouldn't fine you for your racist speech either.
    "The women (sic) is probably an idiot."
    --Quackquack

    Penny Sparrow, an estate agent, probably is not less educated than Quackquack.
    At least her English grammar does not seem worse than Quackquack's.

    Donald Trump likes to accuse his critics of racism too. Quackquack must be relieved that he's not
    going to be fined for being an obstinate racist, bigot, sexist, rape apologist, and pathological liar.
  9. 11 Jun '16 20:39
    One thing that concerns me is the reality that there's ample bigotry and violence against LGBT people in South Africa.
    I believe there have been more than a few public statements approving of such bigotry or violence.
    (For example, some men have advocated the 'corrective' rape of lesbian women.)
    But this popular anti-LGBT speech does not seem to be equally proscribed as 'hate speech'.
  10. 11 Jun '16 20:55
    Originally posted by Duches

    b]One thing that concerns me is the reality that there's ample bigotry and violence against LGBT people in South Africa.
    I believe there have been more than a few public statements approving of such bigotry or violence.
    (For example, some men have advocated the 'corrective' rape of lesbian women.)
    But this popular anti-LGBT speech does not seem to be equally proscribed as 'hate speech'.[/b]
    The sensible solution is to allow free discussion and prevent destructive actions. I obviously am not for corrective rape. But I think we are better off discussing potentially dangerous behaviors and then regulating/ banning them than prohibiting concepts and hoping problems magically go away.
  11. 11 Jun '16 20:58
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    "The women (sic) is probably an idiot."
    --Quackquack

    Penny Sparrow, an estate agent, probably is not less educated than Quackquack.
    At least her English grammar does not seem worse than Quackquack's.

    Donald Trump likes to accuse his critics of racism too. Quackquack must be relieved that he's not
    going to be fined for being an obstinate racist, bigot, sexist, rape apologist, and pathological liar.
    I'm pretty confident that no one on this site would be fined more than you for racist speech.
  12. 11 Jun '16 21:05
    Originally posted by quackquack
    The sensible solution is to allow free discussion and prevent destructive actions. I obviously am not for corrective rape. But I think we are better off discussing potentially dangerous behaviors and then regulating/ banning them than prohibiting concepts and hoping problems magically go away.
    "I obviously am not for corrective rape."
    --Quackquack

    But Quackquack has been condemned as a rape apologist by men such as KazetNagorra and Zahlanzi.
    No1Marauder also has criticized Quackquack for his 'morally disgusting' views about rape.

    Quackquack has a record of lying in attempting to deny the existence of these condemnations.
    Do I need to quote them again?
  13. 11 Jun '16 21:06
    Originally posted by quackquack
    I'm pretty confident that no one on this site would be fined more than you for racist speech.
    Quackquack's an extreme right-wing white American man with a record of racist comments
    against black people and bigoted comments against Muslims.
  14. 11 Jun '16 21:26 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    One thing that concerns me is the reality that there's ample bigotry and violence against LGBT people in South Africa.
    I believe there have been more than a few public statements approving of such bigotry or violence.
    (For example, some men have advocated the 'corrective' rape of lesbian women.)
    But this popular anti-LGBT speech does not seem to be equally proscribed as 'hate speech'.
    Speaking of rape culture in South Africa, here's something about President Jacob Zuma:

    "Zuma (in 2005) stood accused of raping the 31 year old daughter of a family friend.
    He said that the woman in question had provoked him by wearing a skirt and sitting with
    her legs uncrossed, and that it was his duty as a Zulu man to satisfy a sexually aroused woman.
    Such statements reflect the deeply embedded views of many South African men.
    After a two month trial, Zuma was acquitted."
    --Charlayne Hunter-Gault (an African-American journalist in her book _Corrective Rape_)

    It speaks to the depth of misogyny in South Africa that many men could believe that a
    woman who sits with her legs uncrossed while wearing a skirt should be 'fair game' for rape.
  15. 12 Jun '16 01:26
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    "I obviously am not for corrective rape."
    --Quackquack

    But Quackquack has been condemned as a rape apologist by men such as KazetNagorra and Zahlanzi.
    No1Marauder also has criticized Quackquack for his 'morally disgusting' views about rape.

    Quackquack has a record of lying in attempting to deny the existence of these condemnations.
    Do I need to quote them again?
    A few idiots making false accusations does not make them true. The truth is I have always insisted that those accused of rape get full protection of the law. You are so vengeful that you are OK to deny people the opportunity to cross examine present witness and have a beyond reasonable doubt standard.