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  1. Subscriberbadradger
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    26 Oct '18 11:531 edit
    Head of student union states that portrait of fallen 1st world war soldiers (all students that enlisted whilst studying for degrees) should be taken down or painted over because all the subjects were white.....Thoughts?
  2. Standard memberSleepyguy
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    26 Oct '18 13:34
    @badradger said
    Head of student union states that portrait of fallen 1st world war soldiers (all students that enlisted whilst studying for degrees) should be taken down or painted over because all the subjects were white.....Thoughts?
    After a forced humiliating apology, she should be kicked out of the university. Aren't those the rules now?
  3. Subscriberbadradger
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    26 Oct '18 13:55
    @sleepyguy said
    After a forced humiliating apology, she should be kicked out of the university. Aren't those the rules now?
    I don't know about rules, but why has she got a bee in her bonnet about white soldiers that died in a war that happened before her parents were born.
  4. Standard memberDeepThought
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    26 Oct '18 19:55
    @badradger said
    I don't know about rules, but why has she got a bee in her bonnet about white soldiers that died in a war that happened before her parents were born.
    This seems to be a feature of student politics at the moment. There was the SOAS student union complaining about learning "white" philosophy, they didn't want to know about Plato, Kant, and other "white" philosophers. That these people's work is fundamental to European thought seems irrelevant to them.

    Frankly, if they want the mural removed that's fine provided they are prepared to spend 4 years in trenches being bombarded with artillery and sniped at with live rounds. Will they do that? I don't think so.
  5. SubscriberAThousandYoung
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    26 Oct '18 20:131 edit
    @deepthought said
    This seems to be a feature of student politics at the moment. There was the SOAS student union complaining about learning "white" philosophy, they didn't want to know about Plato, Kant, and other "white" philosophers. That these people's work is fundamental to European thought seems irrelevant to them.

    Frankly, if they want the mural removed that's fine provided they ...[text shortened]... being bombarded with artillery and sniped at with live rounds. Will they do that? I don't think so.
    Plenty of nonwhites were in the trenches.

    Mein Kampf v1 ch7

    In these months I felt for the first time the whole malice of Destiny which kept me at the front in a position where every black man might accidentally shoot me to bits, while elsewhere I would have been able to perform quite different services for the fatherland!
  6. SubscriberAThousandYoung
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    26 Oct '18 20:20
    @badradger It’s disrespectful to all the nonwhites who also fought in the trenches.
  7. Standard memberDeepThought
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    @athousandyoung said
    Plenty of nonwhites were in the trenches.

    Mein Kampf v1 ch7

    In these months I felt for the first time the whole malice of Destiny which kept me at the front in a position where every black man might accidentally shoot me to bits, while elsewhere I would have been able to perform quite different services for the fatherland!
    Did I say there weren't?

    Is this before or after US entry into the war? As far as Allied forces are concerned (the US styled herself as an Associated Power) I don't know that black soldiers played a significant part, I do not know that they did not (there will have been some, but I mean as a major demographic).
    Finally I do not think that Hitler is the best source here, he had a somewhat distorted view of the world.
  8. Standard memberDeepThought
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    26 Oct '18 20:57
    @athousandyoung said
    @badradger It’s disrespectful to all the nonwhites who also fought in the trenches.
    This is the point. I don't think it is.
  9. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    26 Oct '18 21:16
    @DeepThought
    Over 1 million Indians served in WW1
  10. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    26 Oct '18 21:19
    @badradger said
    Head of student union states that portrait of fallen 1st world war soldiers (all students that enlisted whilst studying for degrees) should be taken down or painted over because all the subjects were white.....Thoughts?
    If it was a recent work of art then she would have a point.
    But it isn't.
    Of course it should stay.

    The situation can be addressed by simply having more art acknowledging the contribution made by non-whites from the British Empire.

    Maybe some women too!
  11. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    26 Oct '18 21:33
    Don't forget the Gurkhas!

    During World War I (1914–1918) more than 200,000 Gurkhas
    served in the British Army, suffering approximately 20,000
    casualties and receiving almost 2,000 gallantry awards.

    (from wiki)
  12. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    26 Oct '18 21:391 edit
    @deepthought said
    I don't know that black soldiers played a significant part, I do not know that they did not (there will have been some, but I mean as a major demographic).
    As an exception, he (Pershing) did allow African-American combat
    regiments to fight in French divisions. The Harlem Hellfighters
    fought as part of the French 16th Division, earning a unit
    Croix de Guerre for their actions at Château-Thierry,
    Belleau Wood, and Séchault.
  13. SubscriberAThousandYoung
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    26 Oct '18 21:40
    @deepthought said
    Did I say there weren't?

    Is this before or after US entry into the war? As far as Allied forces are concerned (the US styled herself as an Associated Power) I don't know that black soldiers played a significant part, I do not know that they did not (there will have been some, but I mean as a major demographic).
    Finally I do not think that Hitler is the best source here, he had a somewhat distorted view of the world.
    France recruited extensively from its African colonies to man the trenches.
  14. Standard memberDeepThought
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    26 Oct '18 21:401 edit
    @wolfgang59 said
    @DeepThought
    Over 1 million Indians served in WW1
    Yeah, I was wondering about the Indian army. The problem is it's difficult to look these things up - the exact demographics of the various armies aren't a major preoccupation of military historians.

    Edit: note that at the time the Gurkha regiments were part of the Indian Army.
  15. Standard memberDeepThought
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    26 Oct '18 21:43
    @athousandyoung said
    France recruited extensively from its African colonies to man the trenches.
    So should complaints about underrepresentation of black soldiers not be addressed to the French?
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