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Debates Forum

  1. Subscriber mchill
    cryptogram
    17 Sep '17 09:39 / 5 edits
    China is becoming the premier chess power in the world the same way the old Soviet Union did, that is by state support of its players. While players in the West have to supply their own training, housing, food etc. Chinese players have none of these issues, as America's GM Seirawan wrote in 2002:

    The CCA takes a very pro-active approach to organizing events. In the case of most other federations, they rely on the individual creativity and support of organizers. Clearly in the case of U.S. players, they are very individual. They pay for their own coaching... and it all depends how self-motivated they are. With the CCA, they take a different perspective. The players receive government and corporate support. They subsidize the players living and training, housing, provide all your cares....just go out and win events! So in a sense, they are professional athletes, funded by the CCA. They are full professionals and have a high standard of living compared to the average Chinese citizen. So they benefit from literally a state run program.


    As I await the usual nasty, race baiting retort from Duchess, I wonder if a chess world of state supported players vs self supported players somehow delegitimizes team or even world championship events


    http://en.chessbase.com/post/-today-a-gm-title-is-worth-very-little-
  2. Standard member vivify
    rain
    17 Sep '17 14:25 / 3 edits
    The Chinese do the same for the Olympics, through "sport schools". The downside is that these schools leave children very unprepared for anything other Olympic competition. Gold medal winners from China have often been found homeless. China's government usually doesn't help them once they've outlived their athletic usefulness.

    A few years ago, China attempted to improve the quality of education at sport schools. Still, Chinese parents aren't as enamored with the idea of sport schools, as the average wage of parents increase.

    Hopefully, conditions will be better for state-sponsored chess players.

    http://www.newsweek.com/china-rio-de-janeiro-olympics-2016-training-huang-qin-beijing-461351
  3. 17 Sep '17 15:15
    Originally posted by @mchill
    China is becoming the premier chess power in the world the same way the old Soviet Union did, that is by state support of its players. While players in the West have to supply their own training, housing, food etc. Chinese players have none of these issues, as America's GM Seirawan wrote in 2002:

    The CCA takes a very pro-active approach to organizing eve ...[text shortened]... ld championship events


    http://en.chessbase.com/post/-today-a-gm-title-is-worth-very-little-
    "...I wonder if a chess world of state supported players vs self supportited players somehow delegitimizes team or even world championship events"

    Or, as has been done time and again, it is a showcase for competing economic world-views, and a showcase on the other axis, for claims of underlying racial superiority.
  4. 17 Sep '17 16:08
    D must be banned or on vacation at the moment.
  5. 17 Sep '17 17:24
    Originally posted by @eladar
    D must be banned or on vacation at the moment.
    Hopefully. Maybe In a S.Afrika prison. W/all the white man hating feminists.
  6. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    17 Sep '17 22:48
    Originally posted by @kquinn909
    Hopefully. Maybe In a S.Afrika prison. W/all the white man hating feminists.
    Is feminism a crime in South Africa then?
  7. Standard member finnegan
    GENS UNA SUMUS
    17 Sep '17 23:29
    Originally posted by @vivify
    The Chinese do the same for the Olympics, through "sport schools". The downside is that these schools leave children very unprepared for anything other Olympic competition. Gold medal winners from China have often been found homeless. China's government usually doesn't help them once they've outlived their athletic usefulness.

    A few years ago, China atte ...[text shortened]...

    http://www.newsweek.com/china-rio-de-janeiro-olympics-2016-training-huang-qin-beijing-461351
    American allegations about the value of GM norms have caused some upset. I was amused to notice that Ben Finegold (American GM) has insulted Simon Williams (British GM) with the suggestion that his GM title was not merited, and the two are lining up for a grudge match in October to settle the question in the best possible way over the board.

    The Soviets and Chinese (belatedly) certainly see no difficulty in treating sports players as public professionals, but I am not sure the rewards for the successful perfomers compare with those of the most successful stars in the West. Plenty of chess players from soviet countries have taken up residence in western countries and done very well by playing professionally. One benefit of the tournament circuit is that you don't need official permission to play, though there are issues in the West as much as the East about invitations to select events and who gets the best opportunities to achieve their "norms."

    In the West - certainly in Europe - there is a lot of public money spent on sport in diverse forms and amateur sport up to Olympic levels is often subsidised in many ways. Players who turn professional have often had a lot of assistance to reach the required standard.

    In English football there is frequent discussion of the way top clubs pick up young talented players and bring them into their "academies." The successful few can move on to make a fortune while the others are spat out but there has always been an argument that English professionals are vastly less educated than their counterparts in a country like Holland. This is reflected in many aspects of their behaviour, and the average English football professional is a thick lout by any standard, for all their disgusting wealth, but it is also considered to be reflected in the disappointing way the national team plays. A country with the most competitive home leagues somehow can't produce a world class national team. Generally, lack of education is a handicap on many levels.
  8. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    19 Sep '17 11:04
    Originally posted by @kquinn909
    Hopefully. Maybe In a S.Afrika prison. W/all the white man hating feminists.
    You wish. You quiver when confronted by a real mind.
  9. Subscriber mchill
    cryptogram
    19 Sep '17 11:08
    Originally posted by @sonhouse
    You wish. You quiver when confronted by a real mind.
    If PI were equal to two this sentence would not be possible.

    This may indeed be true, but if Pi r squared, then cake r round.