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Debates Forum

  1. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    10 Jul '14 19:45 / 1 edit
    Mark it in your calenders kids. The European court rules that the UK cannot legally gather data on mass of it's citizens. All three parties meet in secret and decide to change the law to legalise the surveillance state. No dissent, not even a discussion. Bye bye democracy, i'd love to say it's been fun but to be quite honest, it's been a complete joke!
  2. 11 Jul '14 09:44 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by Marinkatomb
    Mark it in your calenders kids. The European court rules that the UK cannot legally gather data on mass of it's citizens. All three parties meet in secret and decide to change the law to legalise the surveillance state. No dissent, not even a discussion. Bye bye democracy, i'd love to say it's been fun but to be quite honest, it's been a complete joke!
    Indeed its truly Orwellian. Have you considered the reasons given as to why it needs to be rushed through parliament? Did they strike you as rather odd? It seems that the governments present policy of 'existing blanket surveillance policy has been found unlawful in the courts for breaching human rights' - The Independent. The most worrying aspect is that it is to be based up an American model! Gulp, do you know how long the Americans can hold data for? 15 years! Including content and meta data! Want to know what companies the NSA target? What hardware they use? How they inject packets of data into the online stream to fraudulently trick the user? Indeed one wonders what terrorist threat Mrs Merkel posed that it required her phone to be hacked.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dy3-QZLTpbQ
  3. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 10:08 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Indeed its truly Orwellian. Have you considered the reasons given as to why it needs to be rushed through parliament? Did they strike you as rather odd? It seems that the governments present policy of 'existing blanket surveillance policy has been found unlawful in the courts for breaching human rights' - The Independent. The most worrying aspect ...[text shortened]... the online stream to fraudulently trick the user?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dy3-QZLTpbQ
    I have been looking into this a lot recently. Basically, the Government has to rush this because they are being taken to court by privacy advocates. If they can change the law before the end of the trial then poof! No way to lose.

    The fact of the matter is the Metadata is just a smoke screen anyway. GCHQ has recorded all Data/voice travelling over the phone lines for over a decade and stored it, but it is inadmissible in court. By retrospectively gathering 'metadata' from a legitimate (legal) source they can present a case in court that wasn't produced ---->ILLEGALLY<----

    This STINKS to high heaven!!! When you couple this with the blanket news blackout of dissent it becomes pretty clear the UK is now a police state. Did you hear about the 50,000 people who marched through London a couple of weeks ago? They started outside BBC house and marched to Parliament. Was it reported? Nothing!! The silence was just deafening.

    The Government is happy to Kick this debate down the road till 2016, it gives them plenty of time to completely twist the debate. It'll only take a couple of terror alerts and a few Muslims plastered on the front pages of the tabloids and that will be that. Next we'll have domestic drones flying around our windows filming us taking a cr@p. Makes me sick! Liberal democracy, what a joke!
  4. 11 Jul '14 10:19 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Marinkatomb
    I have been looking into this a lot recently. Basically, the Government has to rush this because they are being taken to court by privacy advocates. If they can change the law before the end of the trial then poof! No way to lose.

    This STINKS to high heaven!!! When you couple this with the blanket news blackout of dissent it becomes pretty clear the ...[text shortened]... ying around our windows filming us taking a cr@p. Makes me sick! Liberal democracy, what a joke!
    The NSA and GCHQ has the capability to remotely intercept data flow from eight miles away! That means they can sit remotely a safe distance from your house and send encapsulated packets of data to your home router tricking it into sending out information! and its been alleged that the same technology can be adapted to drones for huge data collection.

    I never heard of the demonstration, strangely enough, man the BBC is a the worst, a really bad joke.

    If it is for criminal and terrorist threats one wonders what terrorist and criminal activities Mrs Merkel was engaged in which promoted her to become a target of NSA surveillance! You cannot believe a single word they say, honestly.
  5. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 10:26 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    The NSA has the capability to remotely intercept data flow from eight miles away! That means they can sit remotely a safe distance from your house and send encapsulated packets of data to your home router tricking it into sending out information! and its been alleged that the same technology can be adapted to drones for huge data collection.

    I n ...[text shortened]... er to become a target of NSA surveillance! You cannot believe a single word they say, honestly.
    100% agree! Technology has 'advanced' to the stage where these fascists don't even need to pretend anymore. The opposition is already silenced before it has even had a chance to form. The information they have gathered on everyone is so utterly, mind blowingly complete, that any potential opposition can be discredited immediately. Who do you vote for now? Three parties, one message. Democracy my a***.

    EDIT: Oh yes, the remote access of your router. I was learning about that a couple of days ago. If you have a totally wired router (no wifi capability) does that mitigate this??

    EDIT II: The thing that scares me the most is the listening in through your computer/mobile phone speakers. If you think about it, it won't be long before it will theoretically be possible to record every computer in real time and store all conversations as well as specific 'chatter over the phone line'. Where does all this stop? The more you think about it the clearer it becomes. There is no defense, humanity is going down in flames and it's just around the corner..
  6. 11 Jul '14 10:50 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Marinkatomb
    100% agree! Technology has 'advanced' to the stage where these fascists don't even need to pretend anymore. The opposition is already silenced before it has even had a chance to form. The information they have gathered on everyone is so utterly, mind blowingly complete, that any potential opposition can be discredited immediately. Who do you vote for now ...[text shortened]... e of days ago. If you have a totally wired router (no wifi capability) does that mitigate this??
    Yes it might mitigate this but they can even exploit the router hardware or bombard your machine in other ways and even if they cannot they will just siphon off the data at some other point. If you want to stay anonymous then i suggest using the TOR network, its pretty awesome if you use the TOR browser bundle. Although when using red hot pawn you need to give javascript temporary permission because the menus are javascript.

    Yes, apple products are meant to be the easiest to compromise because they write crap software, you can access the speakers, the camera, take screenshots etc etc
  7. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 10:58 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    Yes it might mitigate this but they can even exploit the router hardware or bombard your machine in other ways and even if they cannot they will just siphon off the data at some other point. If you want to stay anonymous then i suggest using the TOR network, its pretty awesome if you use the TOR browser bundle. Although when using red hot pawn you n ...[text shortened]... ause they write crap software, you can access the speakers, the camera, take screenshots etc etc
    I'm way ahead of you dude! I use Peerblock, bleachbit, a second proxy, a firewall. Although my mission for today is to migrate to Linux. Flash player gives over your location for crying out loud. Windows is just not an option anymore. If these people want to know what i'm doing they'll be able to, but i'll be damned if i'm going to make it easy!
  8. 11 Jul '14 11:15 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Marinkatomb
    Mark it in your calenders kids. The European court rules that the UK cannot legally gather data on mass of it's citizens. All three parties meet in secret and decide to change the law to legalise the surveillance state. No dissent, not even a discussion. Bye bye democracy, i'd love to say it's been fun but to be quite honest, it's been a complete joke!
    We are headed for some very dark times, much like the Nazi threat half a century ago, only it is world wide now.
  9. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 11:19
    Originally posted by whodey
    We are headed for some very dark times, much like the Nazi threat half a century ago, only it is world wide now.
    Yeh, and there's no knight in shinning armour coming to rescue us this time either.
  10. 11 Jul '14 11:24
    Originally posted by Marinkatomb
    Mark it in your calenders kids. The European court rules that the UK cannot legally gather data on mass of it's citizens. All three parties meet in secret and decide to change the law to legalise the surveillance state. No dissent, not even a discussion. Bye bye democracy, i'd love to say it's been fun but to be quite honest, it's been a complete joke!
    So it's not democratic when elected officials make decisions you disagree with?
  11. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 11:27 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    So it's not democratic when elected officials make decisions you disagree with?
    It's undemocratic when all three parties leaders meet/discuss and come to a conclusion outside of parliament, yes. If this was discussed in parliament then the discussion would be a matter of public record, there would be an opportunity for dissenting opinion. The whole thing was rubber stamped behind closed doors. That is not how it's meant to work!
  12. 11 Jul '14 11:34
    Originally posted by Marinkatomb
    It's undemocratic when all three parties leaders meet/discuss and come to a conclusion outside of parliament, yes. If this was discussed in parliament then the discussion would be a matter of public record, there would be an opportunity for dissenting opinion. The whole thing was rubber stamped behind closed doors. That is not how it's meant to work!
    I don't know the details of the British system, but doesn't Parliament have the authority to overrule the government and/or send them home and call new elections?
  13. Subscriber Wajoma
    Die Cheeseburger
    11 Jul '14 11:39
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    So it's not democratic when elected officials make decisions you disagree with?
    The title of the thread is "The Day Freedom Died"

    What has democracy got to do with freedom?
  14. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 11:46
    Originally posted by KazetNagorra
    I don't know the details of the British system, but doesn't Parliament have the authority to overrule the government and/or send them home and call new elections?
    Parliament is made up of three parties. The leaders of all three parties are saying the same thing. If their members have a different view (and i'm sure a lot of them do) they will never be part of the discussion because there isn't going to be a discussion. The decision has been made, end of discussion.
  15. Standard member Marinkatomb
    wotagr8game
    11 Jul '14 11:48
    Originally posted by Wajoma
    The title of the thread is "The Day Freedom Died"

    What has democracy got to do with freedom?
    Ok, 'The day privacy died.' I see privacy as a freedom, but if you want me to be specific then there you go..