Please turn on javascript in your browser to play chess.
Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. 07 Sep '17 22:45 / 1 edit
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rohingya_people

    "The Rohingya people .. are a stateless[21] Indo-Aryan people from Rakhine State, Myanmar.
    There were an estimated 1 million Rohingya living in Myanmar.[22]
    As of September 2017, nearly half of them have fled to other countries.[23]
    The majority are Muslim while a minority are Hindu.[24][25][26][1][27]
    Described by the United Nations in 2013 as one of the most persecuted
    minorities in the world,[28][29][30] the Rohingya population are denied
    citizenship under the 1982 Burmese citizenship law."

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/07/massacre-at-tula-toli-rohingya-villagers-recall-horror-of-myanmar-army-attack

    "Massacre at Tula Toli: Rohingya recall horror of Myanmar army attack."

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/sep/05/rohingya-aung-san-suu-kyi-nobel-peace-prize-rohingya-myanmar

    "Take away Aung San Suu Kyi’s Nobel peace prize. She no longer deserves it
    Once she was an inspiration. Now, silent on the plight of the Rohingya
    in Myanmar, she is complicit in crimes against humanity."
    --George Monbiot

    "By any standards, the treatment of the Rohingya people, a Muslim minority
    in Myanmar, is repugnant. By the standards Aung San Suu Kyi came to
    symbolise, it is grotesque. They have been described by the UN as “the world’s
    most persecuted minority”, a status that has not changed since she took office."

    "I recognise that the armed forces retain great power in Myanmar, and
    that Aung San Suu Kyi does not exercise effective control over them.
    I recognise that the scope of her actions is limited. But, as well as a
    number of practical and legal measures that she could use directly to
    restrain these atrocities, she possesses one power in abundance: the
    power to speak out. Rather than deploying it, her response amounts to
    a mixture of silence, the denial of well-documented evidence, and the
    obstruction of humanitarian aid."

    In my view, ignorant 'liberal' Westerners overidealized Aung San Suu Kyi.
    They also have overidealized the Dalai Lama (who was on the CIA's payroll
    and never criticized any US war crimes, even against Buddhists, in Vietnam).

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/sep/03/we-die-or-they-die-rohingya-insurgency-sparks-fresh-violence-in-myanmar

    "'We die or they die': Rohingya insurgency sparks fresh violence in Myanmar.
    A military group has emerged in Rakhine state intent on fighting back
    against what it sees as decades of oppression by the Buddhist majority."

    "Rohingya are considered the largest group of stateless people in the world,
    according to the recent commission report by former United Nations head
    Kofi Annan. Reviled by many in Myanmar as illegal immigrants, they are
    denied the ability to move freely. Hundreds of thousands have been confined
    to internal displacement camps since clashes with Buddhists in 2012.
    Neighbouring Bangladesh views them as a security threat and is
    reluctant to take in more refugees."

    "While Myanmar authorities portray them as Islamist radicals, there is
    little evidence that religion has served as a motivating factor for recruits.
    But the campaign has had religious overtones. The Crisis Group report,
    which was based on interviews with members of the group as well as
    sources in the area and the diaspora, found Islamic clerics had blessed
    training camps and issued fatwas legitimising the group.

    “Indonesian and Malaysian extremists have been chomping at the bit to
    go help their brothers in Myanmar,” says Sidney Jones, director of the
    Jakarta-based Institute for Policy Analysis of Conflict."
  2. Standard member shavixmir
    Guppy poo
    08 Sep '17 16:55
    I am the most persecuted person on the planet.
    I have to put up with all that right-wing moronity. Day in, day out.
    It's like scrotal torture to the sound of Metallica whinging about losing money on Napster 24/7.
  3. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    08 Sep '17 17:29
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    I am the most persecuted person on the planet.
    I have to put up with all that right-wing moronity. Day in, day out.
    It's like scrotal torture to the sound of Metallica whinging about losing money on Napster 24/7.
    I think you are confusing yourself with Trump....
  4. 08 Sep '17 18:34
    Originally posted by @sonhouse to shavixmir
    I think you are confusing yourself with Trump....
    US President Trump has not yet made a statement about the plight of the Rohingya.
    I expect him, before being briefed, to be completely ignorant about this people.

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/07/myanmar-rohingya-refugees-trump-response-242442

    "Trump urged to speak up over potential Myanmar genocide"

    "The Trump administration is under growing pressure from Congress and human rights activists
    to condemn Myanmar’s government for what some call a potential genocide by its security forces.

    Amid reports of massacres and the flight of more than 150,000 minority Muslim Rohingya
    civilians from the country, neither the White House nor the State Department have issued
    recent statements on the growing crisis in a long-isolated country with which former
    President Barack Obama worked hard to restore relations."

    "The National Security Council and State Department have provided boilerplate
    statements expressing "deep concern" about the situation to reporters who ask."

    There's no domestic political risk for American politicians to condemn Myanmar.
    Who cares about offending Asian Buddhists who persecute Asian Muslims?
  5. Subscriber mchill
    cryptogram
    08 Sep '17 20:18
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    US President Trump has not yet made a statement about the plight of the Rohingya.
    I expect him, before being briefed, to be completely ignorant about this people.

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/07/myanmar-rohingya-refugees-trump-response-242442

    "Trump urged to speak up over potential Myanmar genocide"

    "The Trump administration is under gr ...[text shortened]... ians to condemn Myanmar.
    Who cares about offending Asian Buddhists who persecute Asian Muslims?
    There's no domestic political risk for American politicians to condemn Myanmar. Who cares about offending Asian Buddhists who persecute Asian Muslims?


    If I may ask, suppose American politicians do condemn Myanmar as you want them to. Will their words change what is going on in that part of the world??
  6. 08 Sep '17 20:43
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    I am the most persecuted person on the planet.
    I have to put up with all that right-wing moronity. Day in, day out.
    It's like scrotal torture to the sound of Metallica whinging about losing money on Napster 24/7.
    Jesus loves you Shav.

    And Trump does too.
  7. 08 Sep '17 21:02 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by @mchill
    There's no domestic political risk for American politicians to condemn Myanmar.
    Who cares about offending Asian Buddhists who persecute Asian Muslims?

    If I may ask, suppose American politicians do condemn Myanmar as you want them to.
    Will their words change what is going on in that part of the world??
    In fact, some American politicians already are condemning Myanmar, but President Trump's not among them.
    Given his zeal to exclude Muslims from the USA, President Trump may privately
    sympathize with Myanmar using military force to drive its Muslim minority away.

    No one can know to what extent President Trump's statements condemning Myanmar will lead to change.
    But it's clear enough that keeping silent will *not* lead to change. So, on one hand, there's
    the possibility of change as opposed to, on the other hand, the certainty of no change.

    US government statements may be taken more seriously if backed by actions, such as
    economic sanctions against Myanmar. As an urgent humanitarian mission, the USA
    should offer immediate aid to Bangladesh in order to help the influx of refugees.

    I would add that there's a risk in saying and doing nothing. If Muslims perceive that the USA
    apparently condones the persecution and massacres of Muslims in Myanmar, then it
    will become even easier for terrorist organizations to recruit Muslims to fight the USA.
  8. 08 Sep '17 22:03
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    In fact, some American politicians already are condemning Myanmar, but President Trump's not among them.
    Given his zeal to exclude Muslims from the USA, President Trump may privately
    sympathize with Myanmar using military force to drive its Muslim minority away.

    No one can know to what extent President Trump's statements condemning Myanmar will lead ...[text shortened]... en it
    will become even easier for terrorist organizations to recruit Muslims to fight the USA.
    Maybe Obama will get back into office and attack that region and save them like he saved Libya.
  9. Standard member shavixmir
    Guppy poo
    10 Sep '17 06:32
    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-41139319

    Seemingly Boris Johnson (If Trump had a child with the clown from IT and it suffered from dementia... Boris is what it would be) has spoken up for the Rohingya.

    And there's a great sentence in the article too: "The Rohingya claim that security forces and Buddhist mobs of burning their villages."

    It's not everyday one reads of Buddhist mobs burning villages.
    Indeed, how many people considered the Tamil tigers a terrorist organisation? When it's the Sri Lankan government that is considered to have committed war crimes and crimes against humanity. They, the government forces that is, are Buddhist too.
  10. 10 Sep '17 18:55
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    It's not everyday one reads of Buddhist mobs burning villages.
    Not if one only gets one's news from Tumblr, no.
  11. 10 Sep '17 20:47
    Originally posted by @shavixmir
    I am the most persecuted person on the planet.
    I have to put up with all that right-wing moronity. Day in, day out.
    It's like scrotal torture to the sound of Metallica whinging about losing money on Napster 24/7.
    You prolly luv the nutsack torture. Prolly the anal torture ass well. Freaking commie.
  12. 22 Sep '17 19:05
    BBC journalist Fergal Keene to Aung San Suu Kyi in a 2017 interview:
    "[Westerners are] expecting you to be this sort of amalgam of Mahatma Gandhi and
    Mother Teresa, for example, and actually maybe you're closer in your determination and
    steeliness to someone like Margaret Thatcher?"

    "I am just a politician. I am not quite like Margaret Thatcher, no, but on the other hand,
    I am no Mother Teresa, either. I have never said that I was. Mahatma Gandhi, actually,
    was a very astute politician."
    --Aung San Suu Kyi

    Here's a sympathetic view of her from Kevin Rudd, who was Prime Minister of Australia:
    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/21/opinion/myanmar-rohingya-aung-san-suu-kyi.html?mcubz=0

    "Myanmar’s Rohingya Crisis Meets Reality"

    "The international community, therefore, faces a dual crisis of its own: First, an enormous
    humanitarian emergency in Rakhine State. Second, a military strategy manufactured to
    undermine Ms. Aung San Suu Kyi’s standing at home and abroad, and to pave the way
    for a return to a form of military rule.

    When the United Nations sits down to decide what to do, both these factors must be considered.
    The Rohingya must be protected as a matter of the highest priority. But so, too, must we
    stand up for the fledgling democracy in Myanmar. That requires not only demanding that
    the military end its brutal campaign against the Rohingya, but also not retreating from supporting
    Ms. Aung San Suu Kyi. And the body formed to carry out the Annan commission
    recommendations needs more international support.

    Ms. Aung San Suu Kyi is no saint; no political leader is. Yet unless the international
    community focuses on the full dimensions of this crisis, not only will the humanitarian disaster
    for the Rohingya be prolonged, we will also see the end of democratic rule in Myanmar."
    --Kevin Rudd