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Debates Forum

  1. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:30
    Whodey posted on another thread about BH owing all sorts of back taxes. Fine, that's not a huge deal. Corporations often have issues with paying their taxes. As long as they pay everything eventually with interest and penalties, well, no harm, no foul.

    But the other thing people have forgotten is that Buffet has set up his estate plan to take advantage of the unlimited transfer tax charitable deduction to give away almost all of his assets in a manner that avoids all transfer tax.

    http://money.cnn.com/2006/06/25/magazines/fortune/charity1.fortune/

    Most of this money will simply be spirited out of the US tax-free to be spent on causes (albeit worthwhile causes) that have no positive effect on the US economy).

    So, while demanding tax hikes for the rich, his maneuvering will cost the US government about $15B (depending on estate tax rates at the time) because he is perfectly willing to take advantage of the charitable deduction, even while railing against the under-taxation of the rich.

    Nice, Warren. Nice.
  2. 02 Sep '11 18:34
    Originally posted by sh76
    Whodey posted on another thread about BH owing all sorts of back taxes. Fine, that's not a huge deal. Corporations often have issues with paying their taxes. As long as they pay everything eventually with interest and penalties, well, no harm, no foul.

    But the other thing people have forgotten is that Buffet has set up his estate plan to take advantage of th ...[text shortened]... le deduction, even while railing against the under-taxation of the rich.

    Nice, Warren. Nice.
    Perhaps he is just becoming senile.
  3. 02 Sep '11 18:36 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by sh76
    Whodey posted on another thread about BH owing all sorts of back taxes. Fine, that's not a huge deal. Corporations often have issues with paying their taxes. As long as they pay everything eventually with interest and penalties, well, no harm, no foul.

    But the other thing people have forgotten is that Buffet has set up his estate plan to take advantage of th ...[text shortened]... le deduction, even while railing against the under-taxation of the rich.

    Nice, Warren. Nice.
    So where is the bill closing the loophole? Is it a loophole?

    I'm not sure I even care about this at all. Is he giving his money to charities in order to avoid taxes or is it because he wants to support those causes?
  4. 02 Sep '11 18:43
    I'm not following. I read the article and they said he's donating 75% of his Berkshire holdings to various charities.

    What are you criticizing him about?
  5. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:44
    Originally posted by PsychoPawn
    So where is the bill closing the loophole?
    You don't think it's the slightest bit hypocritical to drive a truck through a loophole and then demand that it be closed?
  6. 02 Sep '11 18:45
    Originally posted by sh76
    You don't think it's the slightest bit hypocritical to drive a truck through a loophole and then demand that it be closed?
    He's actually not demanding that this one be closed - he was talking about income taxes if I am not mistaken when it comes to the claim that the rich were under-taxed.
  7. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:45
    Originally posted by USArmyParatrooper
    I'm not following. I read the article and they said he's donating 75% of his Berkshire holdings to various charities.

    What are you criticizing him about?
    By giving them to charity, he avoids paying estate or gift tax, thereby depriving the government of the very money that he is demanding that they collect from people of his and of much, much lower ilks.
  8. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    02 Sep '11 18:45
    Originally posted by USArmyParatrooper
    I'm not following. I read the article and they said he's donating 75% of his Berkshire holdings to various charities.

    What are you criticizing him about?
    Clearly Buffet is dastardly and is giving away his estate to dodge taxes on it.
  9. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:46
    Originally posted by PsychoPawn
    He's actually not demanding that this one be closed - he was talking about income taxes if I am not mistaken when it comes to the claim that the rich were under-taxed.
    Money is fungible. What's the difference which tax the money comes from?

    Are you saying that the estate tax is a less moral tax than the income tax and so Buffet is justified in avoiding one and demanding an increase in the other?
  10. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:47 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    Clearly Buffet is dastardly and is giving away his estate to dodge taxes on it.
    Missed the point.

    I'm sure he wants to support those organizations. But he is using a loophole to avoid paying tens of billions and then demanding that the government go take thousands from other people.
  11. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    02 Sep '11 18:50
    It's his estate plan. He'll be dead. He won't be paying taxes on anything.
  12. 02 Sep '11 18:50
    Originally posted by sh76
    Money is fungible. What's the difference which tax the money comes from?

    Are you saying that the estate tax is a less moral tax than the income tax and so Buffet is justified in avoiding one and demanding an increase in the other?
    Yes, money is obviously fungible. Suggesting one thing should be taxed at a higher rate is not the same as saying everything should be taxed at a higher rate.

    I'm not saying anything you are suggesting I am at all. I'm not making a moral claim at all about taxes.

    I'm saying that he may not actually be donating to charities in order to avoid taxes. It's not hypocritical to donate to charity and advocate for higher income taxes.

    Do you think the only reason he's donating the money to charity is to avoid the estate taxes? I'm sure he'll really enjoy not having to pay them when he's six feet under.
  13. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:53
    Originally posted by AThousandYoung
    It's his estate plan. He'll be dead. He won't be paying taxes on anything.
    Aren't you the anti-inheritance guy? You should be screaming about how high estate taxes should be.
  14. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    02 Sep '11 18:54
    Originally posted by PsychoPawn
    Yes, money is obviously fungible. Suggesting one thing should be taxed at a higher rate is not the same as saying everything should be taxed at a higher rate.

    I'm not saying anything you are suggesting I am at all. I'm not making a moral claim at all about taxes.

    I'm saying that he may not actually be donating to charities in order to avoid taxes. ...[text shortened]... tate taxes? I'm sure he'll really enjoy not having to pay them when he's six feet under.
    Of course people set up their estate plans to avoid estate tax all the time. Estate tax planning is a cottage industry. You think people don't try to avoid estate taxes just because they'll be dead?
  15. Subscriber AThousandYoung
    Poor Filipov :,(
    02 Sep '11 18:55
    Originally posted by sh76
    Aren't you the anti-inheritance guy? You should be screaming about how high estate taxes should be.
    I have no problem changing this law. Has Buffet actively campaigned in favor of this loophole?