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  1. Zugzwang
    Joined
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    09 Jul '18 21:051 edit
    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jul/09/world-cup-semi-finals-immigration

    "What do the World Cup semi-finalists all have in common? Immigration
    Be it Croatia’s hero hailing from Switzerland or the 50% of French and Belgian
    players with African ancestry, immigration is at the heart of each squad"

    "Today’s semi-final between France and Belgium is proof of the enormous
    influence the sons of of African immigrants have played in confirming
    European football’s place at the pinnacle of the global game.
    In total 23 players – exactly 50% – in Didier Deschamps’ and Roberto
    Martínez’s squads – can trace their ancestry to Africa."

    "“When things were going well, I was reading newspaper articles and they
    were calling me Romelu Lukaku, the Belgian striker,” wrote the Manchester
    United forward in an article for the Players’ Tribune last month.
    “When things weren’t going well, they were calling me Romelu Lukaku,
    the Belgian striker of Congolese descent.” "

    "A few weeks after a teenage Pelé’s heroics for Brazil in the 1958 World
    Cup in Sweden, Brussels hosted the world fair, an event that lasted 200
    days and was designed to celebrate the postwar advances made by
    European nations. It featured a stand with 600 Congolese men, women
    and children showcasing their “native conditions” in a manufactured
    “village scene” – later described as the world’s last “human zoo”."

    "After the introduction of a national programme to use football to help
    integrate recent migrants, and the grassroots transformation at the turn
    of the century, the results have been spectacular: Belgium’s golden
    generation has emerged."

    Success in European football often depends disproportionately upon players of African immigrant background.
    Whether that success will lead to greater acceptance of African (or other non-white) immigrants
    in these European societies remains to be seen.
  2. Zugzwang
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    09 Jul '18 21:181 edit
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jul/09/world-cup-semi-finals-immigration

    "What do the World Cup semi-finalists all have in common? Immigration
    Be it Croatia’s hero hailing from Switzerland or the 50% of French and Belgian
    players with African ancestry, immigration is at the heart of each squad"

    "Today’s semi-final between France and Bel ...[text shortened]... ropean football often depends disproportionately upon
    players of African immigrant background.
    "Success in European football often depends disproportionately upon players of African immigrant background."
    --Duchess64

    I note that these players are generally evaluated and allowed to participate by white coaches or managers.

    Success in Western mathematics and science competitions depends disproportionately
    upon students of Asian immigrant backgrounds. This success generally depends upon
    objective examination results rather than subjective talent evaluation by coaches or managers.

    In 2017, the USA selected a total of 23 students for its Olympiad teams in mathematics,
    physics, chemistry, biology, and informatics. There was one white, no blacks or Latinos.
    The other 22 were Asians (17 Chinese, 4 Indians, 1 Korean).

    These selections were made based upon academic performances, without American
    affirmative action measures such as race-norming or racial quotas. If a racial quota
    had been imposed, there would have been at most one token Asian American.
    I say 'at most' because I expect that, if a racial quota existed, Asian American students
    would prefer to boycott--as is their right--the US Olympiad teams rather than accept it.
  3. Joined
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    09 Jul '18 21:342 edits
    Shucks

    I thought the answer might be 'they all have a chance, out of all the countries in the world that play football , of winning the 2018 World Cup'

    Immigration? Doesn't every country in the world have at least some immigration?

    Silly me
  4. Zugzwang
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    09 Jul '18 21:53
    Originally posted by @blood-on-the-tracks
    Shucks

    I thought the answer might be 'they all have a chance, out of all the countries in the world that play football , of winning the 2018 World Cup'

    Immigration? Doesn't every country in the world have at least some immigration?

    Silly me
    "Immigration? Doesn't every country in the world have at least some immigration?"
    --Blood on the Tracks

    Disingenuous. Some countries are much more restrictive than others toward immigration.
    By the way, how many people would want to emigrate to the DPRK (North Korea)?

    The article's point is that European football has become stronger on account of the
    presence of many players of African immigrant background.
  5. SubscriberTom Wolsey
    Aficionado of Prawns
    Texas
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    09 Jul '18 21:551 edit
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    The article's point is that European football has become stronger on account of the
    presence of many players of African immigrant background.
    Are African football players naturally superior to Europeans?
  6. Joined
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    09 Jul '18 21:57
    [i]Originally posted by @duchess64

    Disingenuous. Some countries are much more restrictive than others toward immigration.
    Disingenuous. Trite, even. But I see no denial of my claim from D64, so I am guessing that it is trite but true.

    Certainly not denying that players from all backgrounds enhance the England team.
  7. Joined
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    09 Jul '18 21:59
    Originally posted by @tom-wolsey
    Are African football players naturally superior to Europeans?
    Clearly not, as African nations have a woeful record in the World Cup.

    Who are the best footballers in the world at the moment? Few would argue with Messi and Ronaldo.
  8. Zugzwang
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    09 Jul '18 22:00
    Originally posted by @blood-on-the-tracks
    Disingenuous. Trite, even. But I see no denial of my claim from D64, so I am guessing that it is trite but true.

    Certainly not denying that players from all backgrounds enhance the England team.
    There are about 200 countries in the world. I cannot instantly check to see how many
    immigrants every one of these countries allowed in the last year.
    I cannot recall any immigration to the DPRK (North Korea) last year.
  9. Joined
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    09 Jul '18 22:02
    You should try Google

    Works for most people
  10. Joined
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    09 Jul '18 22:03
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jul/09/world-cup-semi-finals-immigration

    "What do the World Cup semi-finalists all have in common? Immigration
    Be it Croatia’s hero hailing from Switzerland or the 50% of French and Belgian
    players with African ancestry, immigration is at the heart of each squad"

    "Today’s semi-final between France and Bel ...[text shortened]... ance of African (or other non-white) immigrants
    in these European societies remains to be seen.
    So what you are saying is the speed and quickness of the black athlete dominates in sports requiring speed and quickness.

    Nice observation. You see the same thing in the NFL and college football.
  11. Joined
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    09 Jul '18 22:42
    Originally posted by @duchess64
    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jul/09/world-cup-semi-finals-immigration

    "What do the World Cup semi-finalists all have in common? Immigration
    Be it Croatia’s hero hailing from Switzerland or the 50% of French and Belgian
    players with African ancestry, immigration is at the heart of each squad"

    "Today’s semi-final between France and Bel ...[text shortened]... ance of African (or other non-white) immigrants
    in these European societies remains to be seen.
    Can there be a more high - profile endorsement for ethnic diversity than an ethnically diverse world cup winning football team? All kinds of man - people hugging each other; works for me.
  12. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    09 Jul '18 22:48
    Reminds me of a great meme circulating

    Never mind that immigration to the EU has been an unmitigated disaster, have you considered that these immigrants are good at kicking a round, rubber sphere?!

    Lol
  13. SubscriberWOLFE63
    Tra il dire e il far
    C'e di mezzo il mar!
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    09 Jul '18 22:55
    Originally posted by @indonesia-phil
    Can there be a more high - profile endorsement for ethnic diversity than an ethnically diverse world cup winning football team? All kinds of man - people hugging each other; works for me.
    Ethnic diversity is an admirable and exclusive feature of the Western teams in the World Cup.

    How many caucasians were on the sides of: Senegal, Nigeria, Egypt, Japan, South Korea, Iran, Saudi Arabia... etc.?

    I wonder how those facts might be twisted into reflecting the "awful racism" of the West by hers truly?
  14. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    09 Jul '18 23:00
    Right, see, there's this expectation that white nations having their identities permanently changed is a sort of progress but I don't think any of these nations operate off of the same principle.

    Indeed, some of the posters here just have unmitigated hatred for all things white, and they attack it ruthlessly and without any sense of irony as "racist." To be white in any way that isn't apologetic and shamefsced is inexcusable.

    However, any exclusion of white people or non white ethnic nationalism is just some natural, normal expression.
  15. Seongnam, S. Korea
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    09 Jul '18 23:02
    I think believing in some cartoonish racism and exclusion of others and some zero immigration society is utterly ignorant and foolish.

    But yeah, believing the opposite, that there is no significant cultural or ethnic identity and nations aren't entitled to the preservation of their identity is utterly ridiculous.
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