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  1. Standard memberRemoved
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    07 Mar '17 16:51
    What if Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton Had Swapped Genders?

    https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html

    This is an amazing story. Two liberal professors (political science and theater) teamed up on a project that they thought would back up their beliefs about the 2016 election, but instead, it shattered them. They produced a play that recreated one of the presidential debates, only with the genders switched: an actress took the Trump role and a male actor played Hillary. They watched videos to get the words, gestures, body language and tone of voice exactly the same; only the genders were changed. The creators expected that it would prove the cherished liberal contention that “a woman wouldn’t have been able to get away with the aggressive Trump style” and if Hillary had been a man and not fighting sexism, she would have won.

    Instead, they were stunned to discover their own and the liberal audience’s reaction was the opposite. Without the blinders of their personal animosity for Trump and their pro-feminist bias, the female Trump surrogate seemed loose, confident and plain-spoken. Trump's debate strategies that they remembered negatively suddenly seemed effective. They appreciated her clear message. Some compared her to a Jewish aunt or former middle school principal whom they didn’t like personally, but they knew she was looking out for their own good. Some said she seemed like someone they’d like to share a beer with.

    Meanwhile, they were put off by the male version of Hillary, who seemed stiff, cautious and over-rehearsed. He talked and talked without saying anything and just kept fake-smiling inappropriately until some felt an urge to punch him. Liberals came out of the play finally starting to understand why their relatives voted for Trump. And no doubt feeling shaken to the core to realize that sexism did play a role in the election, but it was their own sexism: Hillary didn’t lose because she was woman, but that might be the only reason they thought she was a good candidate.

    Click the link to read more and see an excerpt from the play.

    Sincerely,

    Mike Huckabee
  2. Standard membervivify
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    07 Mar '17 17:21
    This doesn't prove anything. A lot of context was missing. If the female Trump turned out to be a proven pathological liar like Trump, who said women should be punished for abortions, she'd kill family members of terrorists, advocated a ban against an entire religion, etc., the female Trump would be just as unpopular.

    Sarah Palin was just as big of an idiot as Trump, who also opposed abortion even in cases of rape. She was just as outspoken and colorful as Trump, and spit much of the same anti-Obama rhetoric. She pretty much IS a female Trump. Liberals have treated her not much differently.

    I see the point the play is trying to make, but it makes the wrong assumptions. It assumes sexism was at the root of why people hated these candidates, rather than their beliefs.
  3. Standard membervivify
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    07 Mar '17 17:29
    John Kerry is pretty much a male Hillary: boring and void of charisma, wasn't good impromptu speaker, and all he had going for himself was "at least I'm not Bush", just like with Hillary and Trump. The difference was, though, that Kerry wasn't actually hated by members of his own party; Dems were indifferent toward him.
  4. Standard memberRemoved
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    07 Mar '17 18:36
    Originally posted by vivify
    John Kerry is pretty much a male Hillary: boring and void of charisma, wasn't good impromptu speaker, and all he had going for himself was "at least I'm not Bush", just like with Hillary and Trump. The difference was, though, that Kerry wasn't actually hated by members of his own party; Dems were indifferent toward him.
    Maybe, but he would have lost too
  5. Standard memberRemoved
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    07 Mar '17 18:37
    Originally posted by vivify
    This doesn't prove anything. A lot of context was missing. If the female Trump turned out to be a proven pathological liar like Trump, who said women should be punished for abortions, she'd kill family members of terrorists, advocated a ban against an entire religion, etc., the female Trump would be just as unpopular.

    Sarah Palin was just as big of an i ...[text shortened]... assumes sexism was at the root of why people hated these candidates, rather than their beliefs.
    But the actors used the same words of both candidates, including body language.
  6. Standard membervivify
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    07 Mar '17 19:114 edits
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    But the actors used the same words of both candidates, including body language.
    Right; but the audience is still seeing two new people, and are forming opinions of those actors' performances for the first time. Put it this way:

    Man: Hello.
    Woman: Hi.
    Man: How are you?
    Woman: Okay.
    Man: Good. I'm glad.

    Imagine the preceding lines are from a movie, taking place between a brother and sister. Nothing special, right? Now imagine this conversation took place between the same brother and sister after the man served time in prison for killing the woman's children. Those lines now take on a completely different tone. The context would change the audience's perception of the conversation.

    It's the same with this play. If it's been established that the female Trump has views that are largely seen as racist and war-mongering, the audience's view of the female Trump would change due to the context. Because context is lacking from this performance, this can't be used to imagine what a Trump/Hillary race would look like with swapped genders. If background were given to the audience prior to watching this debate, then it would be much more interesting to see if the audience's reaction is different.
  7. Standard membervivify
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    07 Mar '17 19:12
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    Maybe, but he would have lost too
    True.
  8. Standard membershavixmir
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    07 Mar '17 19:43
    What a stupid bloody experiment.
  9. Standard membersh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
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    07 Mar '17 20:20
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    What if Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton Had Swapped Genders?

    https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html

    This is an amazing story. Two liberal professors (political science and theater) teamed up on a project that they thought would back up their beliefs about the 2016 election, but instea ...[text shortened]...

    Click the link to read more and see an excerpt from the play.

    Sincerely,

    Mike Huckabee
    If female Trump had bragged about grabbing men by the crotch, she'd probably have gained 10 points in the polls.
  10. Zugzwang
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    07 Mar '17 20:351 edit
    I already created a thread about this subject (which seems taken more seriously when a man starts talking about it).

    https://www.redhotpawn.com/forum/debates/could-donna-trump-have-been-elected-us-president.171704/page-1

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/29/clinton-trump-gender-swap-play-her-opponent
  11. Standard memberRemoved
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    07 Mar '17 23:23
    Originally posted by shavixmir
    What a stupid bloody experiment.
    Cmon, are you calling liberals stupid now?
  12. Standard memberkaroly aczel
    The Axe man
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    07 Mar '17 23:34
    Originally posted by sh76
    If female Trump had bragged about grabbing men by the crotch, she'd probably have gained 10 points in the polls.
    lol...crack up man 😀
  13. Joined
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    08 Mar '17 02:31
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    What if Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton Had Swapped Genders?

    https://www.nyu.edu/about/news-publications/news/2017/march/trump-clinton-debates-gender-reversal.html

    This is an amazing story. Two liberal professors (political science and theater) teamed up on a project that they thought would back up their beliefs about the 2016 election, but instea ...[text shortened]...

    Click the link to read more and see an excerpt from the play.

    Sincerely,

    Mike Huckabee
    Did the male Hillary lie about giving away state secrets via his private server?
  14. Standard memberRemoved
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    08 Mar '17 04:22
    Originally posted by whodey
    Did the male Hillary lie about giving away state secrets via his private server?
    LOL, they had to rehearse what was said during the debates, so probably yes.
  15. Standard membervivify
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    09 Mar '17 15:35
    Originally posted by Duchess64
    I already created a thread about this subject (which seems taken more seriously when a man starts talking about it).

    https://www.redhotpawn.com/forum/debates/could-donna-trump-have-been-elected-us-president.171704/page-1

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/jan/29/clinton-trump-gender-swap-play-her-opponent
    This topic seems to get more of a response when started by someone much less despised by both men and women.
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