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Debates Forum

  1. Standard member spruce112358
    Democracy Advocate
    18 Jan '12 07:03 / 1 edit
    To protest SOPA and Protect IP bills, Wikipedia (english) will be down for 24 hours.

    Is this an appropriate action?
  2. Standard member shavixmir
    Guppy poo
    18 Jan '12 07:05
    I don't see why I, living in the Netherlands, should be blocked because of some moronic bill in the US.

    But, yes. Who the hell are governments to tell me what I can and cannot see on internet. F- them.
  3. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    18 Jan '12 07:48
    Originally posted by spruce112358
    To protest SOPA and Protect IP bills, Wikipedia (english) will be down for 24 hours.

    Is this an appropriate action?
    It will be drawing a lot of people's attention to the issue.
  4. 18 Jan '12 08:02
    Originally posted by shavixmir
    I don't see why I, living in the Netherlands, should be blocked because of some moronic bill in the US.
    The Swedish Wikipedia is still open. How about the Netherland Wikipedia? I think only the Englis language Wikipedia is closed.

    We can live without the Enlish one, just chose another language, and you will have Good ol' Wiki under your fingertips.
  5. Standard member DrKF
    incipit parodia
    18 Jan '12 08:21
    Originally posted by shavixmir
    I don't see why I, living in the Netherlands, should be blocked because of some moronic bill in the US.

    But, yes. Who the hell are governments to tell me what I can and cannot see on internet. F- them.
    As FabianFnas said, it's only the English wiki that's down, so try the .nl version for your wiki fix.

    I think you should be concerned about SOPA because, as I understand it, it could well result in foreign sites being shut down for being accused or even just suspected of 'copyright infringement' by companies who think is a site is or might be 'facilitating' infringement!

    Absolute minimum, it's a dreadfully drafted piece of legislation - probably written by people who don't have the first clue about the internet, with media companies standing behind them trying to get shocking amounts of power to police the web...
  6. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    18 Jan '12 08:32
    Imagine a World
    Without Free Knowledge

    For over a decade, we have spent millions of hours building the largest encyclopedia in human history. Right now, the U.S. Congress is considering legislation that could fatally damage the free and open Internet. For 24 hours, to raise awareness, we are blacking out Wikipedia.
  7. 18 Jan '12 08:58
    Wikipedia is one of the wonders of InterNet. Don't touch it! (... I would say to those who is trying.)
  8. 18 Jan '12 09:22
    Measures such as SOPA wouldn't be necessary if people stopped up- and downloading all kinds of stuff without paying for it. Wikipedia itself also follows these rules by warning not to put anything on it that is protected by copyright.
  9. Subscriber FMF
    a.k.a. John W Booth
    18 Jan '12 09:35
    Originally posted by Great King Rat
    Measures such as SOPA wouldn't be necessary if people stopped up- and downloading all kinds of stuff without paying for it. Wikipedia itself also follows these rules by warning not to put anything on it that is protected by copyright.
    So you you approve of the measures in SOPA as they have been drafted?
  10. 18 Jan '12 09:50 / 1 edit
    I kind of laugh every time I see the word "SOPA".

    Why?

    Because "sopa" is a Swedish word meaning "nitwit".

    "Bara en sopa kan hitta på något sådant"
    means
    "Only a nitwit would come up a such a thing".
  11. Standard member DrKF
    incipit parodia
    18 Jan '12 09:54
    Originally posted by Great King Rat
    Measures such as SOPA wouldn't be necessary if people stopped up- and downloading all kinds of stuff without paying for it. Wikipedia itself also follows these rules by warning not to put anything on it that is protected by copyright.
    But, as I said, the actual draft of the law is so poor that many sites not involved in copyright infringement, inside the US and abroad, could face shut-down.

    You're right - wikipedia itself doesn't fall foul of copyright infringement, but they are still protesting the law because it could, potentially, end up affecting wikipedia and other wholly legitimate websites.
  12. 18 Jan '12 10:04
    Originally posted by FMF
    So you you approve of the measures in SOPA as they have been drafted?
    I read a little bit about SOPA and I remember not liking what I read. Me not liking SOPA doesn't change what I wrote before, though. Too often I've read people complaining about how their "freedom" is impaired if they can't download anything they want for free (I'm paraphrasing). I hate that. It makes a mockery of the word freedom. Freedom does not equal "doing what the hell I want, just because I can".

    I'll look up SOPA in more detail later.
  13. 18 Jan '12 10:06
    Originally posted by DrKF
    But, as I said, the actual draft of the law is so poor that many sites not involved in copyright infringement, inside the US and abroad, could face shut-down.

    You're right - wikipedia itself doesn't fall foul of copyright infringement, but they are still protesting the law because it could, potentially, end up affecting wikipedia and other wholly legitimate websites.
    Fair enough, SOPA may not be a good thing. I'm currently not in a position to be the judge of that. What do you think "we" should do instead of SOPA?
  14. 18 Jan '12 10:47
    Originally posted by Great King Rat
    Measures such as SOPA wouldn't be necessary if people stopped up- and downloading all kinds of stuff without paying for it. Wikipedia itself also follows these rules by warning not to put anything on it that is protected by copyright.
    SOPA, is not 'necessary'. It would not stop people downloading stuff, but would instead cause even more abuse of the law by the US media industry than is already taking place.
    Even the current laws are ridiculous. The current state of affairs in the world today is that everyone who uses a computer or cellphone, is guaranteed to run afoul of a copyright law sooner or later (usually sooner and frequently). This basically means that we live in a society where law breaking is normal. We are all criminals. We know we are. We expect to always be so. We teach our children that it is acceptable.
    Its like putting 20km/h speed limits on the highway then allowing everyone to go at 120km/h.

    Let me also give an example of the current abuse of the copyright laws:
    Here in SA, it is illegal to monitor my online activity.
    However, if someone in the USA, picks up my public IP address on a torrent site somewhere in Europe, they can write a letter to my ISP to say I was downloading copyrighted material.
    My ISP, without verifying the source of the complaint, the complainants credentials, the claimants actual ownership of the material in question, or even whether or not I did or did not download the material, will proceed to threaten me with disconnection from the internet. I won't get a trial. I won't be legally charged with anything. I will be summarily judged guilty on the word of an anonymous person in the US.
  15. Standard member shavixmir
    Guppy poo
    18 Jan '12 10:53
    The US is going to do as they see fit no matter what.
    I think we need to pre-emptively strike them.

    I dunno... make it international law that hamburgers are free...
    Na. That's too slow.

    NUKE EM.
    Just nuke em.

    Really. In the long run, the collatoral damage will be minimal compared to the faeces we're otherwise gonna have to put up with.

    Or... perhaps slightly more seriously, pass international regulation protecting EVERYONE from foreign pressure when it comes to any form of media.

    I mean, I just read that Modern Family is under pressure to cut an episode which has a Little Lilly swearing like a sailor. When Comedy Central imposes such restrictions as BLEEP, when it comes to the Netherlands we get the BLEEP as well....

    That's just not right!
    There's nothing funnier than a 4 year old swearing (especially when it's not yours).