Maradona or Pele

Originally posted by slimjim
I thought Maradona scored two goals against England in the World Cup and it was in Germany not Mexico.

No, compadre, I meant the one with the hand in Mexico 86 world cup,
of course the one where he dribbles from the midfield all the way
to the goal is a beauty, but I like to mention the one with the hands
because it pisses everybody off 😀

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
Maradonna has gone into history as the biggest sports cheat that the world has ever known.

Surely that would be Ben Johnson or someone similar. To be fair, plenty of people have done what Maradona did, just that most of them didn't get away with it.

Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
Maradonna has gone into history as the biggest sports cheat that the world has ever known.

English?

Maradona's is the best. Why?

becasue he won that 1986 world cup on his own. The Argi team was very avg. but he made all the diffirence.

Everyone talks about that hand ball goal against England, and everyone seems to have forgotten all the other goals he scored in that world cup.

Zidane has also done the business when it really mattred.. world cup final goals (2 .v. Brizil) European cup final goal and scored the wining goal in the Champions League final.

A true world class player is someone who does it for his team when it really matters and both of these two players have done that.

Originally posted by shavixmir
English?

Sorry I meant to add - " unless you are Scottish", in which case the nerk is looked on as one of the biggest heroes in sport.
Well you can't blame them I suppose, their own are a bit scarce.

The "gremlin" knew that the whole world had seen him cheat [apart from that rubbish referee] yet he still tried to deny it. Pah!


Ben Johnson was another one, I agree - I would definitely put him in the top 5.


ps. Yep English. 😉

Actually, having thought about it, I think a good contender for biggest cheat in sport is Boris Onischenko. Rigged an olympic fencing tournament by modifiying the electronic scoring so that he could score points at will. Now that's cheating!

Looking for a reference, I found this...

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/osm/story/0,6903,516244,00.html

Originally posted by shavixmir
[b]I've never even heard of Tony Currie

Your ignorance amuses me.
It wouldn't surprise me to learn that you are one of those 'soccer mums' who attend matches and make comments like "boot it"....?

If you're going to project your opinion on an historical football question might I suggest you do a bit of swatting up before you embarrass yourself any further?

Originally posted by SALADIN
Maradona's is the best. Why?

becasue he won that 1986 world cup on his own. The Argi team was very avg. but he made all the diffirence.

Everyone talks about that hand ball goal against England, and everyone seems to have forgotten all the other goals he scored in that world cup.

Zidane has also done the business when it really mattred.. world cup fi ...[text shortened]... e who does it for his team when it really matters and both of these two players have done that.

Really, Maradona won the '86 WC ALMOST alone. The Argi team had Pumpido, Burruchaga, Valdano, etc. But... BEST OF ALL TIMES? Ha... ha... ha... ha... almost funny...

Zidane and Maradona did great things for their teams/selections. But Pelé did better. Remember '58 WC final game: Sweden 2 x 5 Brasil (5!!!!) - Pelé scored 2 times, and he was 17 y/o! Remember '70 WC final game: Brasil 4 (4!!!!) x 1 Itália - Pelé scored 1 goal. Remember Sudamerican Cup: Santos FC won in 62 (vs Peñarol) and 63 (vs Boca Juniors). Remember Intercontinental Cup: Santos FC won in 62 (vs FC Benfica) and in 63 (vs AC Milan). Remember the '62 IC 2nd leg, in Lisboa: Benfica 2 x 5 Santos (5!!!!) - Pelé scored 2 times, and many football columnists wrote this game is the best football game of all times.

TO READ AND TO REMEMBER!

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/110757/santos_versus_benfica_club_world_championship_1962/

Unstoppable. Brilliant. Genius. Or, only, Pelé.

EDIT: for SALADIN: "...IC 2nd leg, in Lisboa: Benfica 2 x 5 Santos (5!!!!) - Pelé scored 3 times..."

Originally posted by Helder Octavio
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/110757/santos_versus_benfica_club_world_championship_1962/

Unstoppable. Brilliant. Genius. Or, only, Pelé.

EDIT: for SALADIN: "...IC 2nd leg, in Lisboa: Benfica 2 x 5 Santos (5!!!!) - Pelé scored 3 times..."

Listen friend.. i know you come from brazil.. and ok pele was great.

But i just think, maradona was better, the teams he played against in the 80s and 90s were better then the team of the 50s and 60s and 70s.

Thats just the way it is.

Originally posted by Helder Octavio
Really, Maradona won the '86 WC ALMOST alone. The Argi team had Pumpido, Burruchaga, Valdano, etc. But... BEST OF ALL TIMES? Ha... ha... ha... ha... almost funny...

Zidane and Maradona did great things for their teams/selections. But Pelé did better. Remember '58 WC final game: Sweden 2 x 5 Brasil (5!!!!) - Pelé scored 2 times, and he was 17 y/o! R ...[text shortened]... lumnists wrote this game is the best football game of all times.

TO READ AND TO REMEMBER!

1970 finals... Brazil had; Carlos Alberto; Gérson; Jairzinho, Tostão and Rivelino.... are you saying they were not as good as Punpido, Burruchaga etc?

1958- did Djalma Santos, Zito, Bellini, Nilton Santos, Garrincha, Didi, not contribute in the games..did pele do it all himsefl?

Originally posted by SALADIN
1970 finals... Brazil had; Carlos Alberto; Gérson; Jairzinho, Tostão and Rivelino.... are you saying they were not as good as Punpido, Burruchaga etc?

1958- did Djalma Santos, Zito, Bellini, Nilton Santos, Garrincha, Didi, not contribute in the games..did pele do it all himsefl?

In really, my friend, I´m suspect to write about Brazilian football. It´s one of my great passions. And we can´t debate with passion. As a contemporary portuguese philosopher (for coincidence, my father) always says: 'There are 4 things no one can discuss: politics, religion, football and women'.
Pause for an history: my father (Jun 30th 1939) always liked to play football, he was the # 8 (left midfield) of the team of Vinhais, village of Trás-os-Montes; he immigrated in 1956; in 66, he was working in a pub in São Paulo (downtown) with a cousin of mine, and the owner was my uncle (he had a radio in the pub); when Portugal defeats Brasil (3 x 1) in the WC, the 2 cousins started a great party INSIDE the pub, and my uncle throwed out them for maintain the pub open; they joined 2 more friends with the same age and continued the party ON THE STREETS, screaming 'PORTUGAL!!! PORTUGAL!!!' like crazy monkeys; of course, no one Brazilian liked, and many people reacted screaming too: 'YOU PORTUGUESE SONS OF A B****!!!!!!!!!'... Well, the four friends are still alive; HOW, they don´t tell (running, I think)...
End of the pause, I´m sorry if I was rude with you. 🙂
But (always has a 'but'😉 there are little details about your post.
'58 WC: Pelé, Garrincha and Didi didn´t play the games against Austria (2 x 0) and England (0 x 0), they entered against USSR after the President of the Brazilian Confederation, Paulo Machado de Carvalho, in reunion with the players, intervene with the coach Vicente Feola, and Djalma Santos played only in the final game;
'70 WC: Brasil had Carlos Alberto, Gérson, Jairzinho, Tostão, Rivelino + Clodoaldo, but Pelé was the star up the stars, and all the teams in 70 aren´t children:
21-Jun-1970 MEXICO CITY - Brasil vs. Italy 4:1 (1:1);
17-Jun-1970 GUADALAJARA - Brasil vs. Uruguay 3:1 (1:1);
14-Jun-1970 GUADALAJARA - Brasil vs. Peru 4:2 (2:1);
10-Jun-1970 GUADALAJARA - Brasil vs. Romania 3:2 (2:1);
7-Jun-1970 GUADALAJARA - Brasil vs. England 1:0 (0:0);
3-Jun-1970 GUADALAJARA - Brasil vs. Checoslovaq 4:1 (1:1).

Originally posted by blade68
Your ignorance amuses me.
It wouldn't surprise me to learn that you are one of those 'soccer mums' who attend matches and make comments like "boot it"....?

If you're going to project your opinion on an historical football question might I suggest you do a bit of swatting up before you embarrass yourself any further?

Good grief! Currie isn't even how you spell the bloody dish!

Originally posted by Helder Octavio
Remember '58 WC final game:

Uh....
Yeah...

Remember the great clash between Scotland and England in 1891?