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  1. 09 Mar '07 22:39 / 2 edits
    Is this site legal for us to use:

    http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/endgame-database.html

    ?
  2. Standard member joneschr
    Some guy
    09 Mar '07 22:59 / 3 edits
    Originally posted by pinkthunder
    Is this site legal for us to use:

    http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/endgame-database.html

    ?
    From the terms of service:

    (b) You will not use chess engines, chess software, chess computers or consult any third party to assist you in any game. Chess books and databases can be consulted during play

    Since this is a database, I think it's allowed, but to be honest I'm not sure. Similarly, I think it's OK to use opening database like RHP's own http://www.redhotpawn.com/gamesexplorer/, but I kinda wonder.

    If it were my site policy I think I'd disallow these, but it's sort of hard to enforce, isn't it?
  3. 09 Mar '07 23:23
    You are not allowed to use endgame databases during a game - but like you say, how it can be enforced is a mystery.
  4. Subscriber Ragnorak
    For RHP addons...
    10 Mar '07 00:31 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
    how it can be enforced is a mystery.
    Very simply.

    Endgame tablebases give perfect endgames. The moves can make no sense to a human whatsoever, not following any general endgame principles, so there would be a difference between the tablebase solution and a strong player's solution.

    [EDIT] Read Gatecrasher's post here...Thread 40977

    D
  5. 10 Mar '07 02:21 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by Ragnorak
    Very simply.

    Endgame tablebases give perfect endgames. The moves can make no sense to a human whatsoever, not following any general endgame principles, so there would be a difference between the tablebase solution and a strong player's solution.

    [EDIT] Read Gatecrasher's post here...Thread 40977

    D
    Yeah when it is a strange series of moves that is required; but with a large percentage of endgames the tablebase moves would be the standard way and so not unlikely for a human, I reckon.
    I know I'm not the only one who can think of ways cheats could probably get away with using them but obviously I'm not going to make suggestions here either.


    edit; I remember that post from Gatecrasher.
  6. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    11 Mar '07 14:23
    Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
    Yeah when it is a strange series of moves that is required; but with a large percentage of endgames the tablebase moves would be the standard way and so not unlikely for a human, I reckon.
    I know I'm not the only one who can think of ways cheats could probably get away with using them but obviously I'm not going to make suggestions here either.


    edit; I remember that post from Gatecrasher.
    But if the fastest mate can be found using only the general principles of the endgame then how does the endgame tablebase help over say a book on endgames?
  7. 11 Mar '07 20:57
    Originally posted by XanthosNZ
    But if the fastest mate can be found using only the general principles of the endgame....
    Not in ALL cases I would think; there again I don't know as I've no experience of tablebases or endgame books.
  8. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    12 Mar '07 08:14
    Originally posted by Dr Strangelove
    Not in ALL cases I would think; there again I don't know as I've no experience of tablebases or endgame books.
    You have one or the other, either the use of tablebases will allow you to find a faster mate that doesn't follow endgame principles, in which case it should be easy to spot the use of tablebases. OR the tablebases give you a line which you could have found otherwise, this can't be spotted but you haven't really gained a great deal over actual endgame study (other than ease of use I suppose).

    And let's face it, 99% of games end before the endgame or in a simple one (KPK, KRK etc.) rather than one of the nasty ones (say KRPKR or KRNKQ).