My Handicapped Tournament

Originally posted by MissOleum
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- MissOleum
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- MissOleum
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- trev33
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Originally posted by fianchettochess
It seems to me that under 20 moves is by far not enough to guarantee checkmate...

Lets say we use Grampy Bobby's guide above:

I am currently rated 1642. If I were to play an 1842 player, I would surely be able to hold on for 19 moves... After 19 moves even if my opponent is up material or has positional advantage, it is unlikely he would be abl ...[text shortened]... he weaker player, even with the greatest of difference margins in ratings.

Thoughts anyone?

i've came up with how i'm going to work the handicaps...it's pretty simple really but still open to objection.

the lowest amount of moves anyone gets to checkmate someone is 20 moves regardless of rating differences. the max will be 50. for every 20 points rating differences 1 move will be taken off the 50 moves. in other words if a 1200 is playing a 1600.....1600 - 1200 = 400 / 20 = 20. 50 - 20 = 30 moves the 1600 will have to beat the 1200.

considering you have to mate your opponent i think that is pretty fair.

the only thing i'm not sure about is that there's draws in normal chess should there be a possibility of a draw here? for example if 40 moves where set and the win was achieved in exactly 40 moves should it be a win for the higher rated player or a draw? i'll let you guys decide on that one.

Originally posted by trev33
i've came up with how i'm going to work the handicaps...it's pretty simple really but still open to objection.

the lowest amount of moves anyone gets to checkmate someone is 20 moves regardless of rating differences. the max will be 50. for every 20 points rating differences 1 move will be taken off the 50 moves. in other words if a 1200 is playing a 1600 d it be a win for the higher rated player or a draw? i'll let you guys decide on that one.

Yes I think your method of determining number of moves the stronger player gets is more reasonable...

So let's say the 1800 player is on move 30 with a 1400 player... Does that mean the 1800 player is forced to immediately resign the game, or can they play on to the inevitable result but just call it a "win" for the 1400 player?

If the exact number of moves is taken then a draw is fair enough - otherwise there wouldn't be any draws! Even then, it's pretty unlikely.

Count me in! Any decent player should be able to beat me in under 25 moves.

Originally posted by fianchettochess
It seems to me that under 20 moves is by far not enough to guarantee checkmate...

Lets say we use Grampy Bobby's guide above:

I am currently rated 1642. If I were to play an 1842 player, I would surely be able to hold on for 19 moves... After 19 moves even if my opponent is up material or has positional advantage, it is unlikely he would be abl he weaker player, even with the greatest of difference margins in ratings.

Thoughts anyone?

Salients points, fianchetto. Purpose of the post was twofold: (1) To peg consideration to the nightmare of playing

unbeaten Weyerstrass, for baseline, and (2) To promote discussion on an equitable handicap scheme. That's all.

Originally posted by trev33
i've came up with how i'm going to work the handicaps...it's pretty simple really but still open to objection.

the lowest amount of moves anyone gets to checkmate someone is 20 moves regardless of rating differences. the max will be 50. for every 20 points rating differences 1 move will be taken off the 50 moves. in other words if a 1200 is playing a 1600 ...[text shortened]... d it be a win for the higher rated player or a draw? i'll let you guys decide on that one.

As this is experimental it will be difficult to guess what arrangement will give a fair chance to all entrants. My guess is that the tournament will be won by someone in the 1500-1600 range who might be strong enough to deliver mate in 30 moves against players 400 below and able to avoid being mated - even if objectively lost - against a 2000. I think if someone delivers mate on or inside the move limit they should progress to the next round. If not their opponent should. You should forget about draws - if one occurs - it is a loss for the stronger player...
I think the stronger player should be white and I don't think it should be a duel - I don't see what status could be given to the second game.
I think everyone is going to find how difficult it is to deliver mate within so few moves against someone hell bent on avoiding it and future trials of this tournament will revise the move limits upwards!

- Diet Coke
- trev33
- MissOleum
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- Aiko
- clandarkfire
- fianchettochess
- Yuga
- badmoon
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- Fools Errand
- Silverstriker
- cashthetrash (assuming no-stars are allowed to join in)

Originally posted by Fools Errand
As this is experimental it will be difficult to guess what arrangement will give a fair chance to all entrants. My guess is that the tournament will be won by someone in the 1500-1600 range who might be strong enough to deliver mate in 30 moves against players 400 below and able to avoid being mated - even if objectively lost - against a 2000. I think i ...[text shortened]... bent on avoiding it and future trials of this tournament will revise the move limits upwards!

Is this premise too complicated?

Originally posted by MissOleum
- Diet Coke
- trev33
- MissOleum
- sbacat
- Aiko
- clandarkfire
- fianchettochess
- Yuga
- badmoon
- Roosty
- Fools Errand
- Silverstriker
- cashthetrash (assuming no-stars are allowed to join in)

- Diet Coke
- trev33
- MissOleum
- sbacat
- Aiko
- clandarkfire
- fianchettochess
- Yuga
- badmoon
- Roosty
- Fools Errand
- Silverstriker
- cashthetrash (assuming no-stars are allowed to join in)
- dweezil

Originally posted by trev33
i've came up with how i'm going to work the handicaps...it's pretty simple really but still open to objection.

the lowest amount of moves anyone gets to checkmate someone is 20 moves regardless of rating differences. the max will be 50. for every 20 points rating differences 1 move will be taken off the 50 moves. in other words if a 1200 is playing a 1600 d it be a win for the higher rated player or a draw? i'll let you guys decide on that one.

it should be a draw if the lesser opponent has insufficient mating material.


edit: count me in

Originally posted by Fools Errand
As this is experimental it will be difficult to guess what arrangement will give a fair chance to all entrants. My guess is that the tournament will be won by someone in the 1500-1600 range who might be strong enough to deliver mate in 30 moves against players 400 below and able to avoid being mated - even if objectively lost - against a 2000. I think i ...[text shortened]... bent on avoiding it and future trials of this tournament will revise the move limits upwards!

everyone seems to be happy with the handicap system so i think i'll stay with that. however i do like your idea about just playing one game as that was what i had played anyway but i'll see what everyone else thinks before deciding. the reason i was thinking about awarding a draw for exact wins on the target set was to maybe have a better chance of eliminating players as it was a dual. obiouvsly if the game was an actual draw a win to the lower player would be given.

Originally posted by fianchettochess
So let's say the 1800 player is on move 30 with a 1400 player... Does that mean the 1800 player is [b]forced to immediately resign the game, or can they play on to the inevitable result but just call it a "win" for the 1400 player?[/b]

in that case the win would be given to the 1400 player regardless if they played on or not. all games are unrated so i guess it doesn't really matter what happens after the 30 moves.

may I join as a 1700-1800 person since thats where I should be?

Originally posted by thadeusman
may I join as a 1700-1800 person since thats where I should be?

yes, mostly tourney entry ratings will be used but i'll look at everyone graph as well just to make sure it's all fair.