The dam is beginning to break

GOD SAVE US ALL!!

Obama has now come out and said that we can keep our substandard insurance, BUT only for 1 year? Is it to help win in 2014? What are these kids smoking? If our king and savior wishes to be our parent and determine what is beneficial and what is substandard for us, then why wait a year? Either it is "good" for us or "bad" for us. What does one year have to do with anything?

LMAO!!!!!!!!!


King Obama wishes to wave his wand and circumvent yet another law all by his lonesome. Trouble is, it's his own damn law, not to mention being Unconstitutional.

I just read that record numbers of Americans are leaving the country and renouncing their citizenship. This should be good news for Obama and company. Maybe they can win out in 2014 after all.

Originally posted by whodey
GOD SAVE US ALL!!

Obama has now come out and said that we can keep our substandard insurance, BUT only for 1 year? Is it to help win in 2014? What are these kids smoking? If our king and savior wishes to be our parent and determine what is beneficial and what is substandard for us, then why wait a year? Either it is "good" for us or "bad" for us. What ...[text shortened]... hip. This should be good news for Obama and company. Maybe they can win out in 2014 after all.

Are you saying that he caved to the Republicans? Wasn't the idea of putting off Obamacare mandates for individual policies another year proposed by the right wing extremists?

Originally posted by Eladar
Are you saying that he caved to the Republicans? Wasn't the idea of putting off Obamacare mandates for individual policies another year proposed by the right wing extremists?

Yes, but Ted Cruz and company wanted to delay it in order to destroy the country as where Obama wants to delay it in order to save the country.

Obviously you are incapable of seeing the difference.

Originally posted by whodey
Yes, but Ted Cruz and company wanted to delay it in order to destroy the country as where Obama wants to delay it in order to save the country.

Obviously you are incapable of seeing the difference.

I'm glad that you are here to explain it to me so that I can understand it. Thanks again. 😀

Originally posted by Eladar
I'm just trying to understand why the old policies are so inferior to the new policies.

Why are you so hesitant to question Obamacare? I think that questioning the limits of the Federal government is totally relevant to this discussion.

The ACA is an overly complicated crazy quilt of bandages for a very sick health care system that is by virtually every measure among the least efficient and most inequitable health care systems in the developed world. The reasons why the (largely private) US health care system is so poor are themselves somewhat complex and beyond the scope of this thread, but one thing is certain: something has to be done to begin to remedy the situation, and the ACA is, for all its faults, better than nothing. And I hasten to point out, once again, that the Republicans have no plan. None. They'd do nothing but continue to let things deteriorate. That's what Republicans do these days: lift nary a finger to fix anything broken, but bitch and moan at any fixes proposed by others. A little kid could do that, and for less money.

Were it not for Republican obstructionism in 2009, it's possible we could have instituted a public option instead of the legislative behemoth that is the ACA. That would have been a fairly simple piece of legislation, and more in line with proven models of medical care on display for all to see in many other countries. No mandate. Nothing touched in the existing insurance industry. People 65 and over have a public option, and it works. Why not for the rest of us?

I fully expect that the ACA will be supplanted by either a public option (more likely) or single-payer system (less likely) within 10 years. Going back to the way things were, which is the fantasy implicitly being floated in Sasquatch's ridiculous "end of liberalism" thread, is not an option.

Originally posted by Sleepyguy
This crap about "substandard" plans is weak tea. Who the hell do you think you are? The hubris is unbelievable.

Was Kirsten Power's plan substandard? She doesn't think so.

My blood pressure goes up every time they say that they’re protecting us from substandard health insurance plans,” Powers told Bret Baier. “There is nothing to support what ...[text shortened]... than the fact that it’s subsidizing other people. They need to be honest about that.”

Insurance companies pull that kind of crap all the time. If Kirsten's plan really met all the requirements of the Affordable Care Act, then what the insurance company is doing to her has nothing to do with Obama, Democrats, Liberalism, or whatever other kinds of monsters you fancy are doing the mambo under your cradle.

Is everyone so completely mind-wiped by Fox propaganda that they can't remember that this is precisely what insurance companies do all the time, and have done before Obama became president, for no perceptible reason other than pure greed?

Originally posted by KilgoreTrout15
OK genius my wife happens to be one of the people not being allowed to keep her insurance and I'd like to ask you JUST WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT IT?

I know next to nothing about it, and have not claimed otherwise. I am a Zambian living in Cape Town. This health care act does not affect me in any way.
It is interesting though that when I ask for clarification I get insults and screaming. Why is that?

Originally posted by whodey
GOD SAVE US ALL!!

Obama has now come out and said that we can keep our substandard insurance, BUT only for 1 year? Is it to help win in 2014? What are these kids smoking? If our king and savior wishes to be our parent and determine what is beneficial and what is substandard for us, then why wait a year? Either it is "good" for us or "bad" for us. What ...[text shortened]... hip. This should be good news for Obama and company. Maybe they can win out in 2014 after all.

There was a nice article about Americans renouncing their citizenship on the BBC News website some time ago. It seemed that for most people, the main reason was the cumbersome, intrusive and expensive requirement to keep filing taxes every year, even if you have lived abroad for a long time (personally, I haven't spent more than an hour in my entire life doing my taxes).

Originally posted by KazetNagorra
There was a nice article about Americans renouncing their citizenship on the BBC News website some time ago. It seemed that for most people, the main reason was the cumbersome, intrusive and expensive requirement to keep filing taxes every year, even if you have lived abroad for a long time (personally, I haven't spent more than an hour in my entire life doing my taxes).

The US tax codes are complex because of all the special interests (both "left" and "right" ) out there lobbying for special dispensation. There are tons of loopholes and exception clauses in every page of the corporate tax code, for instance. That's why it's thousands of pages long. Republicans love to rage and bellow about how corporate tax rates in the US are among the highest in the world, but in reality when you account for all the loopholes, deductions and write-offs, they're among the lowest. In recent years, for example, Wells Fargo, Verizon, Boeing and General Electric paid no taxes whatsoever.

Originally posted by Soothfast
The ACA is an overly complicated crazy quilt of bandages for a very sick health care system that is by virtually every measure among the least efficient and most inequitable health care systems in the developed world. The reasons why the (largely private) US health care system is so poor are themselves somewhat complex and beyond the scope of this thread, ...[text shortened]... implicitly being floated in Sasquatch's ridiculous "end of liberalism" thread, is not an option.

I do so love the attention, Soothfast...you're making me blush.

However, your assertion that "Republicans did nothing" is nonsense. Republicans tried to protect the American people from this legislation, but Obama insisted, and was willing to risk an unprecedented default on United States debt to stick this law to the American people. Think about that for a moment. Obama was so wedded to his signature legislation that he was willing to inflict great harm on the United States and its people. He was willing to risk a global financial crisis for this legislation!

Obama knew what this legislation would do, knew it wasn't ready, knew he needed a delay - and instead stared down Republicans! What kind of idiot inflicts a wound this grave on himself?

Don't you realize that your man stands alone in the pantheon of Presidential idiocy? When was the last time a President willingly and knowingly took a blowtorch to their reputation and credibility?

I'm enjoying watching him twist. I really am. When was the last time you saw opinion polls swing so wildly, so quickly? My guess is you have to go back to Watergate.

Originally posted by sasquatch672
My guess is you have to go back to Watergate.

I hope it ends the same way.

Originally posted by Soothfast
The ACA is an overly complicated crazy quilt of bandages for a very sick health care system that is by virtually every measure among the least efficient and most inequitable health care systems in the developed world. The reasons why the (largely private) US health care system is so poor are themselves somewhat complex and beyond the scope of this thread, ...[text shortened]... implicitly being floated in Sasquatch's ridiculous "end of liberalism" thread, is not an option.

Obama had both houses of Congress for two years and got nothing done. It's funny time how you types always conveniently forget that.

Originally posted by KazetNagorra
There was a nice article about Americans renouncing their citizenship on the BBC News website some time ago. It seemed that for most people, the main reason was the cumbersome, intrusive and expensive requirement to keep filing taxes every year, even if you have lived abroad for a long time (personally, I haven't spent more than an hour in my entire life doing my taxes).

And there are those leaving because of the political dissent list Obama is making. Which makes more sense. Leaving because of a little paperwork or because their life and the lives of their families may be at risk? BBC news is as bad as CNN or Fox.

Originally posted by Soothfast
So here's the elementary question you should be asking: if there is no substantial difference between the plan someone had and the new plan on offer, then why are insurance companies asking three times the price? There seems to be no rhyme or reason to it, unless one of two things is true:

1) There are in fact substantial differences between old vers ...[text shortened]... h.

Still waiting for the Republican plan for health care reform. Is it still "Die Quickly"…?

The real question is who ought to judge whether an insurance plan is "better"?

Would that not be the insured?