New Webb photo, new details:

@Metal-Brain
He said MATTER can't go faster than c. Jebesus you are dense, more dense than a BH apparently.
Spacetime is the conveyer belt taking matter for a ride, the matter doesn't know it is going faster than c because the space between the particles are stretching, matter doesn't know anything about that but if you tried to run a rocket into that expanding space the speed of light is an invariant, it is the same no matter what frame of reference so if you are in expanding space and try to move matter faster than c you will fail in this local movement. It doesn't know it is already going several times faster than light and that is a totally different can of worms.
So you have two apples on a conveyer belt, TWO conveyer belts, one apple on one belt and the other belt end to end of the first belt, both belts have an apple on it.
Each apple sits happily on the conveyer belt and you run both belts but in opposite directions, they could be going the speed of light but on the belt itself, the apple doesn't move on the belt , the whole belt moves. THAT is like spacetime, stuff can ride the wave of the expansion of the universe without even knowing it is going faster that c because locally it is not going faster than c, we have a galaxy around that would have been long gone by now if it was actually receding faster than light or even half the speed of light. we would SEE the recession right here but space is so big we have to see galaxies a billion or more light years away to be able to suss out the velocity. That also implies there are bits of the universe we can NEVER see because we only see them with elecromagnetic radiation of gravitational wave, those little taffy pulls of space time even those waves go the speed of light so stuff so far away there isn't enough time for light to come in from say 40 billion light years away because we run out of poop at about 14 billion light years, there is most likely stuff out there, whole galaxies, 20 or 30 billion light years away but we will NEVER be able to see them as long as we have to obey the universal speed limit, c.
Those galaxies are gone from our POV but still there in reality.

@sonhouse said
@Metal-Brain
He said MATTER can't go faster than c. Jebesus you are dense, more dense than a BH apparently.
Spacetime is the conveyer belt taking matter for a ride, the matter doesn't know it is going faster than c because the space between the particles are stretching, matter doesn't know anything about that but if you tried to run a rocket into that expanding space the s ...[text shortened]... obey the universal speed limit, c.
Those galaxies are gone from our POV but still there in reality.

@metal-brain said
You are claiming Einstein was wrong. He said nothing can travel faster than the speed of light.

@Metal-Brain
You are talking to Ponderable as if he were an idiot but in fact he has a Phd in chemistry.
He is not some dolt you can insult without consequences COMRADE.
He knows FAR more than you EVER will.

@Metal-Brain
It is not theoretical as you say, you don't even know what THEORY is.
The redshift is due to the expansion of the universe, that has been proven over and over again AND it is STILL expanding faster than c and it is NOT matter doing the moving it is SPACETIME you fukking commie DOLT. And it IS like two conveyer belts near each other going in opposite directions where a cup or something is on both belts and they are not moving at all, but the BELT is. Spacetime is NOT matter and it is ONLY matter that has the c limit, that and radiation, either electromagnetic or gravitational, if it has mass it cannot go the speed of light.
For instance, Neutrinos are ALMOST massless and indeed the beams coming off of stars show they are NOT going right at c, they are a bit behind because of that tiny but ATT unknown exactly what the mass is. It doesn't travel at c therefore it has mass, it is that simple.
But spacetime itself is NOT matter. Get that through your head and maybe you will understand the difference.
I heard that directly from Alan Guth and if you think he is wrong, PROVE IT.
You probably don't even know who Guth is. So here is one MIT paper on him:

https://news.mit.edu/2012/[WORD TOO LONG].&text=Physics%20at%20MIT-,Alan%20Guth%20'68%2C%20SM%20'69%2C%20PhD,'72%2C%20the%20Victor%20F.

Sorry for the long URL.

Here is one with a shorter URL

https://www.kavliprize.org/bio/alan-guth

Another short bit, what prizes did Alan Guth win:

"What awards did Alan Guth win?
Image result for did alan guth win a nobel prize
Guth has been awarded the Franklin Medal for Physics, the Eddington Medal, the Isaac Newton Medal, the Dirac Prize, and the Gruber Prize in Cosmology, and has been elected to the U.S. National Academy of Sciences and the American Academy of Arts and Sciences."

@sonhouse said
@Metal-Brain
It is not theoretical as you say, you don't even know what THEORY is.
The redshift is due to the expansion of the universe, that has been proven over and over again AND it is STILL expanding faster than c and it is NOT matter doing the moving it is SPACETIME you fukking commie DOLT. And it IS like two conveyer belts near each other going in opposite direction ...[text shortened]... een elected to the U.S. National Academy of Sciences and the American Academy of Arts and Sciences."

@metal-brain said
Expansion is not disputed, but you are claiming space itself is expanding. You don't know space itself is expanding. You have not demonstrated that the universe cannot expand in space that is already there. If space is not already there then there is a limited amount of space in the universe. You seem to be suggesting there is a vast area outside of the universe that cont ...[text shortened]... ebb looked in all six directions in space to see if we can see in equal distances in all directions?

@sonhouse said
@Suzianne
I used to be in and out of Bell labs working in a cleanroom there and found in the auditorium a talk by Alan Guth about the big bang and such. He opened it up at the end for questions and I did a bit of math and saw the rough range of the expansion from millimicronnanonano second or so he said it went from something the size of a proton to the size of a grapefruit ...[text shortened]... aller, a scientist at NASA:

Here is a short bio:

https://bigthink.com/people/michelle-thaller/

@Suzianne
Don't feel like the lone Ranger🙂
I speculated this purported Higgs field, apparently soaking the entire universe, is responsible for giving stuff mass.
My speculation is if that is true, could it be involved in there being the speed of light limit for matter in the universe?
We know for instance, as already shown in the big boy's accelerators, stuff gains mass as it gets close to the speed of light, well ANY velocity off dead zero actually but in tiny increments till you close in on light speed, we can see that in the amount of magnetic field strength needed to bend the beam to follow a curve, more magnetic field strength needed the faster the particles go.
So if follows the same thing happens to a space craft trying to get to c or close.
So could it be kind of like the 'higgs field' is a kind of molasses that a craft or particle has to plow through and just going faster interacts with such a field that imparts more mass and more and more till at c the mass would be infinite?

It seems to me spacetime is malleable, gets near a mass and it curves, all well and good but doesn't to me answer the question why do particles gain mass the closer to c they get BESIDES the flow of time slowing down so you go say .99999999c and a trip to some star you THINK just took you a month for a thousand light year journey, but you go back home, a month getting there, another month getting back and back home you now find yourself 2000 years in your future, not a great thing to behold, not only your friend and family long dead but the COUNTRIES you remember would be gone too. NOT ONE country has been around unchanged for 2000 years so that would be a profound change for the traveler but that is entirely another story besides gaining mass the closer you get to c.

So that is my query, could the Higgs Field be responsible for this kind of molasses being plowed through to gain this mass at higher velocities?

@sonhouse said
@Suzianne
Don't feel like the lone Ranger🙂
I speculated this purported Higgs field, apparently soaking the entire universe, is responsible for giving stuff mass.
My speculation is if that is true, could it be involved in there being the speed of light limit for matter in the universe?
We know for instance, as already shown in the big boy's accelerators, stuff gains mas ...[text shortened]... e responsible for this kind of molasses being plowed through to gain this mass at higher velocities?

@metal-brain said
Expansion is not disputed, but you are claiming space itself is expanding. You don't know space itself is expanding. You have not demonstrated that the universe cannot expand in space that is already there. If space is not already there then there is a limited amount of space in the universe. You seem to be suggesting there is a vast area outside of the universe that contains no space.

Has the Webb looked in all six directions in space to see if we can see in equal distances in all directions?

@shallow-blue said
No, he's not. That is a very primitive way of looking at it, showing a lack of understanding of even upper high school geometry.

I would suggest reading, for a start, "Flatland", by Edwin A. Abbott.

Has the Webb looked in all six directions in space to see if we can see in equal distances in all directions?

That question is so ignorant of both the v ...[text shortened]... of the Webb telescope, that no sane answer can be given beyond "of course not, what a stupid idea".

@Metal-Brain
There are many theories calling for a LOT of dimensions, like string theory, wants 11 dimensions.
Some theoreticians think we might even be able to suss out the extra dimensions since they think those dimensions are just curled up into a soda straw configuration and there might be sensed through interactions with gravity, like the gravity around black holes, very strong, and maybe something similar happens with the hidden dimensions.
All theory of course, you don't need to remind us.