spirituality forum

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Why would you say they are extremely ignorant? If there are no moral absolutes, Nazi Germany's standards of morality are equally valid to anyone else's standards.

In general dude. As an overall "consensus", like 'up is up'.

This "moral absolutes' business is discussing an area where the agreement is not as widespread as in say basic physics.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
Either the bible is the word of God or it isn't.

Are you saying God's word is dated and no longer applies?!

Oh, the Bible is the Word of God alright.

Thing is, lots of folks treat the Bible as if it were their God.

Then again, lots of folks treat their interpretation of the Bible as if it were the Word of God, also.

The Word of God is what it is. The problem comes when people start saying it means all kinds of things and insist that people follow them just because they say something different. Man's interpretation is just that, their interpretation. Worshipping the words is folly. But worshipping your own interpretation, or someone else's interpretation, is even more folly.

Originally posted by avalanchethecat
Different how, exactly?

Also, how old are you?

The slavery in the Bible was not based exclusively on race. People were not enslaved because of their nationality or the color of their skin. In Bible times, slavery was based more on economics; it was a matter of social status. People sold themselves as slaves when they could not pay their debts or provide for their families. In New Testament times, sometimes doctors, lawyers, and even politicians were slaves of someone else. Some people actually chose to be slaves so as to have all their needs provided for by their masters.

https://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-slavery.html

What does my age have to do with this?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
What does my age have to do with this?

People may speculate about how old you are because of the way you behave and the things you say.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
Either the bible is the word of God or it isn't.

Are you saying God's word is dated and no longer applies?!

Have you ever heard of the new covenant? The Mosaic Covenant is a treaty God made with the Jews, the nation of Israel. The Mosaic contract is no longer in force. It has been replaced for everyone, including Jews, by the new contract. The new contract is a new enterprise. Gentiles were never under the old contract. Now, Jews and Gentiles alike who put their faith in Jesus are under the new contract.

http://www.str.org/articles/how-does-the-old-testament-law-apply-to-christians-today#.WIlz47Z94mI

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Have you ever heard of the new covenant? The Mosaic Covenant is a treaty God made with the Jews, the nation of Israel. The Mosaic contract is no longer in force. It has been replaced for everyone, including Jews, by the new contract. The new contract is a new enterprise. Gentiles were never under the old contract. Now, Jews and Gentiles alike who put the ...[text shortened]... ttp://www.str.org/articles/how-does-the-old-testament-law-apply-to-christians-today#.WIlz47Z94mI

"Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ; Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart; With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men: Knowing that whatsoever good thing any man doeth, the same shall he receive of the Lord, whether he be bond or free. And, ye masters, do the same things unto them, forbearing threatening: knowing that your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him."

Ephesians 6:5-9

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
The slavery in the Bible was not based exclusively on race. People were not enslaved because of their nationality or the color of their skin. In Bible times, slavery was based more on economics; it was a matter of social status. People sold themselves as slaves when they could not pay their debts or provide for their families. In New Testament times, som ...[text shortened]... rs.

https://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-slavery.html

What does my age have to do with this?

That's some hefty rose-tinted glasses you have on there.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
"Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ; Not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but as the servants of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart; With good will doing service, as to the Lord, and not to men: Knowing that whatsoever good thing an ...[text shortened]... your Master also is in heaven; neither is there respect of persons with him."

Ephesians 6:5-9

Since many of the early Christians were slaves to Romans, they were encouraged to become free if possible, but not worry about it if not possible. The Roman empire practiced involuntary slavery, so rules were established for Christians who were subject to this slavery or held slaves prior to becoming Christians. The rules established for slaves were similar to those established for other Christians with regard to being subject to governing authorities. Slaves were told to be obedient to their master and serve them sincerely, as if serving the Lord Himself.Paul instructed slaves to serve with honor, so that Christianity would not be looked down upon.

As with slaves, instructions were given to their masters as to how they were to treat their slaves. For example, they were not to be threatened, but treated with justice and fairness. The text goes on to explain that this was to be done because God is the Master of all people, and does not show partiality on the basis of social status or position.

There is an interesting letter in the New Testament (Philemon15-21) that gives some insight into the problems encountered in the early Christian church regarding the issue of slavery. Paul, the author of the letter, is writing from a Roman prison awaiting trial. He is writing to Philemon, who runs a local Christian church out of his house (since Christianity was highly persecuted at this point in time). Philemon, we find out, is the master of the slave Onesimus, who has escaped but has been converted to Christianity by Paul. In the letter, Paul indicates that he is sending Onesimus back to Philemon. However, Paul says that he has confidence that Philemon will "do what is proper" although Paul wants him to do it by his "own free will". Even so, Paul indicates that Onesimus would be a great aid in helping him spread the gospel. Paul ends the letter by saying that he has "confidence in your obedience" and indicates that he knows Philemon "will do even more than what I say." Although Paul did not directly order Philemon to release Onesimus from slavery, it would have been difficult to come away with any other conclusion from his letter.

God does not distinguish between slaves and freemen.

The New Testament proclaims that all people are equal in the eyes of God - even slaves:

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. (Galatians 3:28)
knowing that whatever good thing each one does, this he will receive back from the Lord, whether slave or free. (Ephesians 6:8)
And masters, do the same things to them, and give up threatening, knowing that both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no partiality with Him. (Ephesians 6:9)
a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave and freeman, but Christ is all, and in all. (Colossians 3:11)


The idea that God or Christianity encourages or approves of slavery is shown to be false. In fact, anybody who was caught selling another person into slavery was to be executed. However, since voluntary slavery was widely practiced during biblical times, the Bible proscribes laws to protect the lives and health of slaves. Paul, the author of many of the New Testament writings, virtually ordered the Christian Philemon to release his Christian slave from his service to "do what is proper". In addition, numerous verses from the New Testament show that God values slaves as much as any free person and is not partial to anyone's standing before other people.

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/slavery_bible.html

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Since many of the early Christians were slaves to Romans, they were encouraged to become free if possible, but not worry about it if not possible. The Roman empire practiced involuntary slavery, so rules were established for Christians who were subject to this slavery or held slaves prior to becoming Christians. The rules established for slaves were simi ...[text shortened]... e's standing before other people.

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/slavery_bible.html

So, in your new covenant you're cool with slaves trembling with fear before their masters?

Good to know.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
The slavery in the Bible was not based exclusively on race. People were not enslaved because of their nationality or the color of their skin. In Bible times, slavery was based more on economics; it was a matter of social status. People sold themselves as slaves when they could not pay their debts or provide for their families. In New Testament times, som ...[text shortened]... rs.

https://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-slavery.html

What does my age have to do with this?

Skin-colour is entirely irrelevant. Slavery is simply the ownership of one human being by another. You find that morally acceptable? And you think to lecture other people on their morals?

Slavery has always been an economic issue. Not all slaves in the colonies were from Africa, that was just an easy reservoir of subjects available to the slavers. In fact, prior to the popularity of the African subject, there were an awful lot of Irish slaves in the Americas.

Tell me how old you are and I'll tell you what your age has to do with the discussion.

Originally posted by avalanchethecat
Skin-colour is entirely irrelevant. Slavery is simply the ownership of one human being by another. You find that morally acceptable? And you think to lecture other people on their morals?

Tell me how old you are and I'll tell you what your age has to do with the discussion.

Slavery is simply the ownership of one human being by another.

My kids were my slaves ?
The owners of the Washington Redskins are owners of slaves ?
You're a slave to your employer?

I'm telling you avalanchethecat, I think you are OD-ing on Playstation IV or X-Box One.

Originally posted by sonship

Slavery is simply the ownership of one human being by another.

My kids were my slaves ?
The owners of the Washington Redskins are owners of slaves ?
You're a slave to your employer?

I'm telling you avalanchethecat, I think you are OD-ing on Playstation IV or X-Box One.

You don't own your children. The owners of the Washington Redskins don't own the players. My employer doesn't own me.

You, sir, appear to be an idiot.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Since many of the early Christians were slaves to Romans, they were encouraged to become free if possible, but not worry about it if not possible. The Roman empire practiced involuntary slavery, so rules were established for Christians who were subject to this slavery or held slaves prior to becoming Christians. The rules established for slaves were simi ...[text shortened]... e's standing before other people.

http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/slavery_bible.html

The idea that God or Christianity encourages or approves of slavery is shown to be false

No it hasn't. Nowhere in the bible is the ownership of slaves by christians or indeed anybody else castigated. It's fine to own people, and indeed to beat them and to have sex with them without their consent. You're not allowed to steal a loaf of bread to stop your children dying of starvation though. Very reasonable stuff.

Originally posted by avalanchethecat
You don't own your children. The owners of the Washington Redskins don't own the players. My employer doesn't own me.

You, sir, appear to be an idiot.

Sure I owned my kids until they were 18 years of age in this country.
I still feel some ownership of them even now as they are adults.

The word "owners" can apply to person of person relationships without meaning slavery.
As a basketball team made up of humans beings who are said to be owned.

It could be taken to a court of law.
Husband and wife also belong to each other as mutual owners.

The idiot appears to be you in your asinine over simplification of a definite of slavery.