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Originally posted by FMFSonship 'so suffixed question: "are you sure you want to be a diciple of Jesus Christ?" comes across as him saying that if I don't agree with him then my discipleship is certainly in question
If he disagrees with your analysis of Romans 8, do you think his "salvation" is in peril?
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15 Aug 16
Originally posted by divegeesterThis is not a separate topic from the Trinity.
Happy to discuss this separate topic in another thread if you would like to start one.
it seems to me that you are rather cold towards God. The Unitarian theology seems to render your love lukewarm towards the Father - the Son - the Holy Spirit.
Let's say what I just wrote is unfair. Well, I am prepared to retract it as an unfair statement. But look at the evidence.
You do not want to capitalize spirit when the New Testament signifies the Holy Spirit. This Person is the "eternal Spirit" who can be "grieved"
You do not "grieve' a mere power. You would not speak of "grieving" the power of, say, electicity. But Person with feelings you may "grieve".
" And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God in whom you were sealed unto the day of salvation." (Eph. 4:30)
Where is your regard for the Holy Spirit, the "eternal Spirit" ?
i feel happy to indicate a capital "S" to inform the world that the Spirit within me is God Himself. Why He is the Lord Jesus Himself.
" And the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is there is freedom. " (2 Cor. 3:17)
Don't you love the Lord Jesus Christ ?
if "the Lord is the Spirit" why are you so lukewarm to not desire to indicate "the Lord" is the CAPITAL S - Spirit ?
And I puzzle over your lukewarm feeling towards the Jesus praying to His Father in the garden. Correct me if I am wrong. But it seems either you are cold concerning the praying Jesus or you are cold concerning the being prayed TO Father.
Your "ho-hum" description of Christ's intense passion here as being meditating, is perplexing. It appears that either you are untouched by the petitioning Son in His struggle in prayer for your soul or you are untouched with the peititioned Father Who heard these agonizing petitions but demanded that the Son pour out His life for your soul.
Which One are you unmoved by in cold intellectual adherence to "Hear O Israel the Lord your God is one" ?
Is your heart cold towards the utterly obedient Son.
Or are you cold in heart towards the Father Who so loved the world that He commanded of the Son uttermost obedience.
Or are you cold in your heart towards both ?
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2 edits
Originally posted by sonshipEdited:
Is your heart cold towards the utterly obedient Son ?
Or are you cold in heart towards the Father Who so loved the world that He commanded of the Son uttermost obedience ?
Or are you cold in your heart towards both ?
Divegeester, has Unitarian theology chilled your love for God down to a cool lukewarm intellectual distancing from the Father and the Son ?
What has Unitarian theology done for your love for God ?
Where is your appreciation for the Son offering up strong petitions with crying and even sweating drops of blood to His Father for your very salvation ?
Why not tell the Father of your love for Him?
Why not tell the Son Who petitioned on your behalf as "an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the Righteous" that you love Him?
This mysterious God Who is one is no doubt - Father and Son and Holy Spirit.
Unitarian concepts have cooled down your adoration of the Father - Son - Holy Spirit which you dismissively assign a small s to, to a chilled nod at Judaism's "Hear O Israel ..." the Lord your God is not Father - Son - Holy Spirit as three-one. [paraphrased of course]
I want to teach you to let your heart go and love the Trinity. You'll be filled with much more joy.
Don't settle for being "Dead Right" about the Old Testament's shema prayer. The Triune God is life and life more abundantly.
The Old Covenant itself PROMISED there would be a new covenant. in this new covenant the Triune God is more clearly revealed.
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15 Aug 16
Originally posted by sonshipMore ad hominem.
Divegeester, has Unitarian theology chilled your love for God down to a cool lukewarm intellectual distancing from the Father and the Son ?
You wittering on for pages and pages about love the way you are doing is frankly a little creepy. It doesn't come across well at all and is completely irrelevant. As most of your posting on this topic has been - obfuscation and deflection from the question
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1 edit
Originally posted by divegeesterAre you lukewarm towards the Son or the Father or both ?
Ah so you admit that not believing in the trinity makes someone "lukewarm"?
Are we getting somewhere of have you just slipped up? 😉
You do not have to answer me in public. Ask yourself.
You read about Jesus in the Garden of Gethseneme pouring out His soul in agonizing prayer., and you only cooly see "meditating".
He is God become a man. You did admit so I do believe. Unlike the other anti-trinity thinking checkbaiter, you did give me the impression you believe Jesus is God.
Me too !
How can you disimiss His agonizing prayers for you there as merely his meditating ? What has Unitarian theology done for your appreciation of His being an Advocate to the Father there on behalf of your eternal salvation ?
You puzzle me.
Meditatiing ?? Just meditatiing ??
" ... the Son of God Who loved me and gave Himself up for me."
In my opinion your relegating His prayer for you as just meditating exposes a chilly intellectual shallowness of appreciation of Jesus being God as a man.
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3 edits
Originally posted by divegeester
More ad hominem.
You wittering on for pages and pages about love the way you are doing is frankly a little creepy. It doesn't come across well at all and is completely irrelevant. As most of your posting on this topic has been - obfuscation and deflection from the question
More ad hominem.
You wittering on for pages and pages about love the way you are doing is frankly a little creepy. It doesn't come across well at all and is completely irrelevant. As most of your posting on this topic has been - obfuscation and deflection from the question
I said I was going to teach you to love the Trinity. Did I not ?
You see, the passage you love to quote, I believe, says we should love the Lord our God with our whole being - including the heart. No, not just the INTELLECT is involved.
Quote it for me. Doesn't it say we should love the Lord with our whole heart, whole mind, whole strength, whole being or something to that effect ? Right below the part about the Lord your God is one. Am I right ?
So LOVE of God is relevant. You do not have to confess to me. I think you should ask yourself before God though.
"This persuasion is not of Him Who calls you." (Gal. 5:8) [edited]
So in the garden where the Son pours out His petition to the Father, Which causes you to shrug so? The Father or the petitioning Son Who pours out His soul in obedience TO the Father's will ?
Which one are you suggesting i should not be so impressed with as you recite in rote - "Hear Oh Israel the Lord your God is one".
Which one ?
Would you attempt an answer ?
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15 Aug 16
Did anyone see Divgeester come up with a better explanation of how the names are used interchangeably in Romans 8 ?
The Spirit of God.
The Spirit of Christ.
Christ.
The Spirit of the One who raised Jesus from the dead
all indwelling the believer ?
Did anyone see Divegeester do a better job of explaning the interceding Christ at the right hand of God and the indwelling Christ in the believer ?
Did anyone see Divegeester do a better job of explaining the interceding Christ and the indwelling interceding Holy Spirit ?
Did anyone see Divegeester explain the worship as God the God who sits upon the throne AND ... the Lamb in Revelation chapter 5.
I see him reduced from good alternative explanations to little grumpy posts of one liners just showing his stubbornness to cling to Unitarian error.
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15 Aug 16
Originally posted by sonshipThose are all one and the same. Unless you are going to claim there is more than one spirit?
Did anyone see Divgeester come up with a better explanation of how the names are used interchangeably in Romans 8 ?
[b] The Spirit of God.
The Spirit of Christ.
Christ.
The Spirit of the One who raised Jesus from the dead
all indwelling the believer ?
Did anyone see Divegeester do a better job of explaning the interceding Christ at the r ...[text shortened]... to little grumpy posts of one liners just showing his stubbornness to cling to Unitarian error.[/b]
Are you?
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2 edits
Originally posted by divegeesterIf they are one in the same then the truth of the Trinity is upheld.
Those are all one and the same. Unless you are going to claim there is more than one spirit?
Are you?
Why no capitalization of S as Spirit ?
Do you write God in small letters as "god" ?
If they are one Spirit then the Spirit of God is Christ. And Christ is the Spirit of the One who raised Jesus Christ from the dead.
Therefore you admit that the revelation of the three-oneness of Father - Son - Holy Spirit is upheld.
Thankyou !
Praise the Lord.
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15 Aug 16
Originally posted by sonshipBefore we get into this.
If they are one in the same then the truth of the Trinity is upheld.
Why no capitalization of [b]S as Spirit ?
Do you write God in small letters as "god" ?
If they are one Spirit then the Spirit of God is Christ. And Christ is the Spirit of the One who raised Jesus Christ from the dead.
Therefore you admit that the revelation of the three-oneness of Father - Son - Holy Spirit is upheld.
Thankyou !
Praise the Lord.[/b]
Hear oh Israel, the Lord you God is ONE.