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29 May 16
Originally posted by Suzianne
No, of course I'm not speaking for all Christians.
Clearly, FMF is inviting people (Christians)(yes, Christians are people) to give their opinion. Just as he later gives his own, and then turns around and labels ALL Christians with his trademarked broad brush.
[b]"FMF has already made it very clear why he's asking in this thread."
Right. What ...[text shortened]... to tar all Christians with the same handy brush. The extremely broad brush I mentioned earlier.[/b]
No, of course I'm not speaking for all Christians.
Clearly, FMF is inviting people (Christians)(yes, Christians are people) to give their opinion. Just as he later gives his own, and then turns around and labels ALL Christians with his trademarked broad brush.
I know what FMF was asking, your post however read as speaking for all Christians as the question in
the op was "Do Christians believe that their God figure created the Zika virus?" to which you answered
"No"... Which can be read as saying that all Christians don't have that belief, as opposed to just this
particular one doesn't.
I asked for clarification and I got it... No need to bite my head off.
And I don't see FMF labelling all Christians with any sort of brush.. I think that that mostly exists inside
your own head.
Right. What I'm asking for evidence for is his REAL motivation. Which seems to be to tar all Christians with the same handy brush. The extremely broad brush I mentioned earlier.
Sigh... This is some deeply paranoid tin hat stuff here...
Stop trying to read between the lines and just read the lines. FMF from my decade of observation is very straightforward
and has demonstrated no hidden agenda. There is no subtext, it's all text.
However like you do with me [and others] you try to pin nefarious motives upon posts and posters that you have no evidence
for and for which you then give those posters a hard time that they have not earned.
29 May 16
Originally posted by googlefudgeIt's okay. I don't suppose you've noticed the evolution of his posts on RHP as a whole. I'm sure he counts on that, and on people like you drawing the conclusions about him that he wants you to. If you choose to not observe things which pass in front of your face, that's fine, but don't try to include your non-observations in any kind of cohesive thought about something you've chosen not to pay attention to.
Stop trying to read between the lines and just read the lines. FMF from my decade of observation is very straightforward
and has demonstrated no hidden agenda. There is no subtext, it's all text.
However like you do with me [and others] you try to pin nefarious motives upon posts and posters that you have no evidence
for and for which you then give those posters a hard time that they have not earned.
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Originally posted by SuzianneI don't choose not to observe things, I have observed things and I'm telling you what I've observed.
It's okay. I don't suppose you've noticed the evolution of his posts on RHP as a whole. I'm sure he counts on that, and on people like you drawing the conclusions about him that he wants you to. If you choose to not observe things which pass in front of your face, that's fine, but don't try to include your non-observations in any kind of cohesive thought about something you've chosen not to pay attention to.
And I will include my observations in any cohesive thought I feel like.
Originally posted by SuzianneYes. I really can't see how you could think otherwise.
My personal belief? Is that what you're asking?
I believe He intervenes (tweaks the machine) to be sure that evolution is on the proper 'track' to follow His will.
So is the Zika virus his will, or an oversight on his part, or just irrelevant to him?
This is why Man effecting global climate change and viruses running rampant (pestilence and disease) and the extinction of species is happening.
I have to point out here that virus' have always 'run rampant' and there are probably less serious virus' running rampant right now than at any time in the history of man.
The stage is being set for the rise of the AntiChrist.
Purposefully?
Earth was intended to be an Eden, but Evil showed up and Man made the decision to disobey God,
How does a species collectively make a decision? When did this happen?
And God is going to let us reap what we sowed,
No, he's going to let us reap what some distant ancestors sowed.
Originally posted by SuzianneNot at all. I would expect Christians to have a range of views on the questions raised by the OP.
Right. What I'm asking for evidence for is [FMF's] REAL motivation. Which seems to be to tar all Christians with the same handy brush. The extremely broad brush I mentioned earlier.
Originally posted by googlefudgeThere are, for example, some Christians who believe that AIDS is 'God's cure for homosexuality' ~ I met a holidaying married couple a few years ago whose Christian outlook had led them to that belief. I certainly don't think that all Christians think that way.
And I don't see FMF labelling all Christians with any sort of brush.. I think that that mostly exists inside your own head.
Another example is sonship's 'torturer God' ideology and his (for me, anyway) incoherent notions of "justice" and "morality" ~ an ideology that is an expression of his Christian beliefs (and those of plenty of Christians I have met) ~ is one that Christians like divegeester and Suzianne do not share, and I am of course able to recognize that.
Labelling all Christians with the same brush is not something I do.
Originally posted by SuzianneMy OP question was not directed only at "creationist" Christians (by which I assume you mean Genesis literalists like RJHinds) but is for all or any Christians to offer their views on.
Well, I am not a 'creationist', as googlefudge pointed out. If FMF only wanted the opinion of 'creationists', then he should have said so in his OP.
Originally posted by Suzianne[1] Do you believe the existence of phenomena like Zika, Ebola and malaria form part of the manifestation of God's will?
I believe that evolution is part of God's 'creation toolbox'. I believe He intervenes (tweaks the machine) to be sure that evolution is on the proper 'track' to follow His will. But as such, I do not believe He necessarily still intervenes. It's a self-running machine, and self-regulating, for the most part. And it doesn't have much longer to go.
[2] Do you believe Zika - and such things - are among the signs that show we are approaching the 'end times'?
30 May 16
Or it could have been sent by god as an opportunity for us to make an antivirus and maybe even find a cure or maybe just a link to curing cancer or something else like that.
In the past , to overcome hurdles, mankind has had to invent and develop all sorts of life promoting ideas that have helped us, and shaped humanity and (human) knowledge as we know it.
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30 May 16
Originally posted by karoly aczelThat is deeply unethical.
Or it could have been sent by god as an opportunity for us to make an antivirus and maybe even find a cure or maybe just a link to curing cancer or something else like that.
In the past , to overcome hurdles, mankind has had to invent and develop all sorts of life promoting ideas that have helped us, and shaped humanity and (human) knowledge as we know it.
Any being with the capability of a being worthy of the title god, will have a myriad of ways
of improving our lot, without causing such suffering and misery as these diseases cause.
The argument "I only did those terrible things to you to allow you to rise above them" is
one given only by bad guys. Those that are immoral and/or insane.
No ethically good god could do such things.
30 May 16
Originally posted by mariekeXIVIf you want, you can put Zika to one side, and substitute it with Malaria for the purposes of this discussion and the OP questions. Do Christians believe that their God figure created Malaria and if so, what do they believe the purpose of creating it was?
Ok, and you are absolutely sure that it was not genetically engineered?
Suzianne: Right. What I'm asking for evidence for is [FMF's] REAL motivation. Which seems to be to tar all Christians with the same handy brush. The extremely broad brush I mentioned earlier.Whether Suzianne's "paranoia" about hidden agendas or imagined purposes ~ when supposedly discussing things with people who disagree with her ~ is real or merely a deliberate affectation, I cannot say for sure.
Originally posted by googlefudge
Sigh... This is some deeply paranoid tin hat stuff here... Stop trying to read between the lines and just read the lines. FMF from my decade of observation is very straightforward and has demonstrated no hidden agenda. There is no subtext, it's all text.
What is clear though is that she resorts to bringing it into play time and time again either to deliver ad hominems or to sidestep proper discussion of straightforward observations or questions put to her.