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  1. Standard member slappy115
    Slappy slap slap
    05 Jun '08 23:45
    For those who do not know what this is, it is

    1. d4 d5
    2. c4 e5

    It's a way of refusing the Queen's Gambit.

    What does everyone think about it? It is normally what I play against the Queen's Gambit.

    Can anyone recommend any good books on this subject?
  2. 06 Jun '08 01:45
    Another of those silly gambits !
    Maybe you can try this against 1400 players but it's unsound, you'll never see any serious master play this!
    Or so would many players say before morozevitch (not a serious player but n3 player in the world now) began playing it with some success !

    It's a really interesting opening but has the same drawback than the budapest gambit : it doesn't work against 2.Nf3 !

    There's a good survey of the modern way of playing it (i.e : morozevitch's) in one of the secrets of openings surprises series (i don't remember which), new in chess publishing.
    You can also skip trough an online database for moro's games
  3. Standard member slappy115
    Slappy slap slap
    06 Jun '08 02:02
    Originally posted by shorbock
    Another of those silly gambits !
    Maybe you can try this against 1400 players but it's unsound, you'll never see any serious master play this!
    Or so would many players say before morozevitch (not a serious player but n3 player in the world now) began playing it with some success !

    It's a really interesting opening but has the same drawback than the buda ...[text shortened]... , new in chess publishing.
    You can also skip trough an online database for moro's games
    Well it obviuosly doesn't work against 2 Nf3! since I wouldn't play that nor would it be the queen's gambit.

    The book I have on unorthodox openings says there is plenty of literature written on it but does not give any books to look at.

    Thank you for the input. I will look at yoru sources soon.
  4. Standard member wittywonka
    Chocolate Expert
    06 Jun '08 03:04 / 5 edits
    1. d4 d5 2. c4 e5!?



    Firstly, I will say outright that I too think the Albin Countergambit is not completely sound, but I definitely think it is difficult to take advantage of it at a sub-master level. It is usually quite tactical, and as with most gambits, focuses on superior development and attacking in place of the single pawn. I rotate between it and the Queen's Gambit Accepted fairly evenly.

    Here are a few of my games here on RHP using it:

    Game 4508226 -- An interesting game that showed the price for greed.

    Game 4655555 -- A far from perfect game from both players, but still quite interesting nonetheless. Most likely completely unsound for black. (Note -- ceders messaged me towards the end of the game intending to resign; he didn't actually fall for the checkmate there.)

    Game 5056232 -- In Progress -- I thought I would try an early f7-f6, as reccommended by some Albin advocates, in an attempt to speed development and exchange off white's further-developed pawn.

    In addition, there are also quite a few nice websites that offer quite a bit of nice information about the Albin, but the two below encompass them all, in addition to offering separate analyses. Definitely worth a look.

    http://www.kenilworthchessclub.org/kenilworthian/2005/10/albin-counter-gambit-bibliography.html

    http://www.kenilworthchessclub.org/games/java/summer05/albin-nge7.htm
  5. Standard member slappy115
    Slappy slap slap
    06 Jun '08 03:17
    Originally posted by wittywonka
    1. d4 d5 2. c4 e5!?

    [fen]rnbqkbnr/ppp2ppp/8/3pp3/2PP4/8/PP2PPPP/RNBQKBNR[/fen]

    Firstly, I will say outright that I too think the Albin Countergambit is not completely sound, but I definitely think it is difficult to take advantage of it at a sub-master level. It is usually quite tactical, and as with most gambits, focuses on superior development an ...[text shortened]... it-bibliography.html

    http://www.kenilworthchessclub.org/games/java/summer05/albin-nge7.htm
    And all the time you were white...
  6. 06 Jun '08 03:42 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by slappy115
    For those who do not know what this is, it is

    1. d4 d5
    2. c4 e5

    It's a way of refusing the Queen's Gambit.

    What does everyone think about it? It is normally what I play against the Queen's Gambit.

    Can anyone recommend any good books on this subject?
    I think that the Albin is one of those openings that may give you some quick rating points but ultimately retards your chess development. Throwing in the Albin as a surprise weapon now and then, especially when the opponent is carefully selected, is probably a decent idea. However, if you spend 100 hours of your chess time studying and playing the Albin, you are not going to learn nearly as much as someone who spends those same 100 hours playing more reputable openings (QGD, QGA, Nimzo/QID, Slav, Semi-Slav, etc.).

    Scott
  7. Standard member slappy115
    Slappy slap slap
    06 Jun '08 05:03
    Originally posted by smrex13
    I think that the Albin is one of those openings that may give you some quick rating points but ultimately retards your chess development. Throwing in the Albin as a surprise weapon now and then, especially when the opponent is carefully selected, is probably a decent idea. However, if you spend 100 hours of your chess time studying and playing the Albin, y ...[text shortened]... 00 hours playing more reputable openings (QGD, QGA, Nimzo/QID, Slav, Semi-Slav, etc.).

    Scott
    What do you suggest to refuse the queen's gambit?
  8. Standard member najdorfslayer
    The Ever Living
    06 Jun '08 05:32
    Don't tell Morozovich it is not sound, he might be listening.

    Albin is fine all the way to GM Level.

    Moro has played at against super GM's and done okay.

    I am sure it is okay for ordinary GM's and below.
  9. 06 Jun '08 10:04
    Originally posted by slappy115
    Well it obviuosly doesn't work against 2 Nf3! since I wouldn't play that nor would it be the queen's gambit.

    The book I have on unorthodox openings says there is plenty of literature written on it but does not give any books to look at.

    Thank you for the input. I will look at yoru sources soon.
    I believe that Nigel Davies (recent contributor to this forum) in his Gambiteer book recommends 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.c4 e5!? Of course, white doesn't have to play 3.c4.
  10. 06 Jun '08 13:36
    Originally posted by slappy115
    Well it obviuosly doesn't work against 2 Nf3! since I wouldn't play that nor would it be the queen's gambit.
    2.Nf3 is still the queen's gambit if white is playing it to delay c2c4 and prevent gambits. But as northern lad points out ( how could i forget Davies book? i own it! ) 2...Nc6 is a way of maintaining the "threat"

    Now 2.Nf3 can also be played without the idea of c4 (colle, london...) but Davies give some ideas of how to meet those too

    So yes definitely Northern Lad's suggestion is best : Gambiteer 2 by Nigel Davies is the book you need (and you can also find the part against 1.e4 interesting too, if you like gambit play you can ask squelbelch too !)
  11. 06 Jun '08 14:02
    Originally posted by Northern Lad
    I believe that Nigel Davies (recent contributor to this forum) in his Gambiteer book recommends 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.c4 e5!? Of course, white doesn't have to play 3.c4.
    In Gambiteer II there are 16 pages of analysis on 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3

    "A commonly held view is that White can avoid the Albin by playing 2.Nf3 and then 3.c4. This is not strictly true as Black can play 2...Nc6 3.c4 e5, after which White's best is to go back into the Albin with 4.dxe5. But he also has a couple of fourth move alternatives and several different systems on move three.
    The game Kibbermann-Keres (Game 50) features the line 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.c4 e5 4.Nxe5, which reaches a kind of Albin after 4...Nxe5 5.dxe5 d4. Whilst being strategically similar to the Albin, this position has not been analysed very much so there's scope here for creativity.
    White's main fourth move alternative is 4.cxd5, after which 4...Qxd5 transposes into the Chigorin Defence. This can become a Goring Gambit Declined following 5.Nc3 Bb4 6.e3, which in fact was the move order of Narandzic-Blagojevic (Game 51).
    Pigusov-Vera, Adorjan-Morozevich and Malaniuk-Morozevich (Games 52-54) feature the moves 3.g3, 3.Bf4 and 3.e3 respectively. None of these are earth-shatteringly dangerous for Black, but they lead to a very different type of game to the Albin, so Black must be careful not to be psychologically wrong-footed. This is one of the main issues with gambiteering as Black: one must also know when to put the machete away"

    Davies
  12. Standard member slappy115
    Slappy slap slap
    06 Jun '08 14:52
    Originally posted by slappy115
    And all the time you were white...
    Sorry Witty. I was drunk when I posted this. You weren't white once. Again, my sincerest apologies.
  13. 07 Jun '08 00:22
    Originally posted by slappy115
    What do you suggest to refuse the queen's gambit?
    If you've never seriously played the QGD, then that is the place to start to learn about the closed games. Matthew Sadler's excellent book is a great learning tool for the QGD and chess in general.

    Scott