Beating the Grunfeld and KID

This is also a pretty noob thread. KID=Kingside play for black/Queenside for white.

Not that hard

Gruenfeld: Queenside majority/counterratack for black, center control and kingside for white

Originally posted by MoneyMaker7
This is also a pretty noob thread. KID=Kingside play for black/Queenside for white.

Not that hard

Gruenfeld: Queenside majority/counterratack for black, center control and kingside for white

You're retarded.

Please go light yourself on fire.

Originally posted by cmsMaster
You're retarded.

Please go light yourself on fire.

I don't know if you know this, but 1250's know more than us. It's like golf. His score is better, because it sucks more.

Originally posted by !~TONY~!
I don't know if you know this, but 1250's know more than us. It's like golf. His score is better, because it sucks more.

Oh that's how it works? Man, maybe I am a newb.

Originally posted by cmsMaster
Oh that's how it works? Man, maybe I am a newb.

Welcome to the club.

Originally posted by !~TONY~!
Welcome to the club.

We're in good company gents. I just quoted an opinion by none other than Nigel Short, and it was dismissed as being the thoughts of some guy by a 1200 ish player.

Originally posted by cmsMaster
I've been practicing 1.d4 for a little while now, and I like it a lot. Play the Queen's Gambit supplied me with an excellent repertoire against 1...d5, but facing 1...Nf6 causes me more of a dilemma.

I'm really unsure of what to play against the KID and Grunfeld. I want something that's not a theoretical monster, but still completely (And I mean compl for other lines I could use against the KID or Grunfeld - particularly something active?

You seem to like aggressive game so I suggest you try to Saemisch- 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.e4 d6 5.f3

White's plan here is to castle queenside and throw a kingside pawn storm. If black doesn't know how to play it correctly, he can get into a LOT of trouble. I recommend you look into it.

The four pawns is probably more difficult for black to play against, since it comes up rarely and black is less likely to be prepared for it.

Edit: Looks like people already beat me there

I searched through my ICC Database and found some games where I played the four pawns, just for entertainment.

[Event "ICC 5 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.07.29"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TonyRo"]
[Black "Morfina"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A68"]
[WhiteElo "1851"]
[BlackElo "1780"]
[PlyCount "69"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "300"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 g6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 c5 6. d5 O-O 7. Nf3 e6 8. Be2 exd5 9. cxd5 b5 10. e5 dxe5 11. fxe5 Ng4 12. Bg5 Qb6 13. O-O c4+ 14. Kh1 Nf2+ 15. Rxf2 Qxf2 16. Ne4 Qb6 17. Be7 Re8 18. Nd6 Rxe7 19. Nxc8 Qb7 20. Nxe7+ Qxe7 21. d6 Qd7 22. Qd5 Nc6 23. Nd4 Bxe5 24. Nxc6 Qxd6 25. Ne7+ Qxe7 26. Qxa8+ Kg7 27. Qf3 Bxb2 28. Rf1 Qe6 29. Qf2 c3 30. Bxb5 Qxa2 31. Qd4+ Kg8 32. Bc4 c2 33. Bxa2
Bxd4 34. Bxf7+ Kg7 35. Bb3 {Black resigns} 1-0

[Event "ICC 5 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.07.31"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TonyRo"]
[Black "chess1980"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A68"]
[WhiteElo "1858"]
[BlackElo "1835"]
[PlyCount "37"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "300"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 c5 7. d5 e6 8. Be2 exd5 9. cxd5 Ne8 10. O-O f5 11. e5 dxe5 12. fxe5 Nd7 13. Bg5 Qc7 14. d6 Qc6 15. e6 Ne5 16. d7 Nxf3+ 17. Bxf3 Bd4+ 18. Kh1 Qxe6 19. Bd5 {Black disconnected and forfeits} 1-0

[Event "ICC 5 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.08.03"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TonyRo"]
[Black "livis"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "E76"]
[WhiteElo "1980"]
[BlackElo "1833"]
[PlyCount "73"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "300"]

1. d4 g6 2. c4 Bg7 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. e4 d6 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 Bg4 7. Be2 Bxf3 8. Bxf3 Nc6 9. d5 Nb4 10. O-O Ne8 11. Be3 c5 12. dxc6 Nxc6 13. Nd5 e6 14. Nc3 a6 15. Qd3 Qc7 16. Rfd1 h6 17. Rac1 Kh7 18. Nd5 Qc8 19. Nb6 Qd8 20. Nxa8 Qxa8 21. b3 Qc8 22. e5 dxe5 23. Qd7 Qxd7 24. Rxd7 exf4 25. Bxf4 Nf6 26. Rxb7 Nd4 27. Rd1 Nxf3+ 28. gxf3 Nh5 29. Bd6 Rd8 30. Rxf7 Kg8 31. Rb7 Be5 32. Rb8 Rxb8 33. Bxb8 Bf6 34. c5 Ng7 35. c6 Ne8 36. c7 Nxc7 37. Bxc7 {Black resigns} 1-0

[Event "ICC 5 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.07.24"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TheShootah"]
[Black "melissa"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A68"]
[WhiteElo "1900"]
[BlackElo "1880"]
[PlyCount "57"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "300"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 d6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 c5 7. d5 e6 8. Be2 exd5 9. cxd5 Bg4 10. O-O Nbd7 11. Re1 Re8 12. h3 Bxf3 13. Bxf3 Qa5 14. Be3 b5 15. a3 b4 16. axb4 Qxb4 17. Qd2 Nb6 18. Bf2 Nc4 19. Qd3 Nxb2 20. Qc2 Nd7 21. e5 dxe5 22. Reb1 exf4 23. Na4 Rab8 24. Nxb2 Bxb2 25. Ra2 Qc3 26. Rbxb2 Rxb2 27. Rxb2 Re1+ 28. Kh2 Qxc2 29. Rxc2 {Black resigns} 1-0

[Event "ICC 3 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.06.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TheShootah"]
[Black "Ramme"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A69"]
[WhiteElo "1894"]
[BlackElo "1754"]
[PlyCount "49"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "180"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 c5 7. d5 e6 8. Be2 exd5 9. cxd5 Re8 10. e5 dxe5 11. fxe5 Ng4 12. Bg5 Qa5 13. O-O Nxe5 14. d6 c4 15. Nd5 Qc5+ 16. Kh1 Nd3 17. Nc7 Bg4 18. Nxe8 Nd7 19. Nxg7 Kxg7 20. Bxd3 cxd3 21. Qxd3 f6 22. Rac1 Qa5 23. Qe4 Ne5 24. Rc7+ Kh8 25. Bxf6+ {Black resigns} 1-0

[Event "ICC 5 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.06.09"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TheShootah"]
[Black "cambil"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "E76"]
[WhiteElo "1931"]
[BlackElo "1835"]
[PlyCount "37"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "300"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 Na6 7. e5 Nd7 8. h4 c5 9. d5 dxe5 10. h5 exf4 11. Bxf4 e6 12. hxg6 fxg6 13. Bd6 Re8 14. Be2 exd5 15. Qxd5+ Kh8 16. Ng5 Nf6 17. Nf7+ Kg8 18. Nh6+ Kh8 19. Qg8+ {Black resigns} 1-0

[Event "ICC 3 0 u"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.06.18"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TheShootah"]
[Black "WateryGrave"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A69"]
[WhiteElo "2041"]
[BlackElo "2046"]
[PlyCount "69"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "180"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 c5 7. d5 e6 8. Be2 exd5 9. cxd5 Re8 10. e5 dxe5 11. fxe5 Ng4 12. Bg5 f6 13. exf6 Bxf6 14. Qd2 Bf5 15. O-O Nd7 16. h3 Bxg5 17. Qxg5 Ne3 18. Rf2 Nb6 19. Bb5 Bd7 20. Bxd7 Qxd7 21. Ne5 Qe7 22. Qxe3 Qxe5 23. Qxc5 Rac8 24. Qa3 Nxd5 25. Nxd5 Qxd5 26. Raf1 Qd4 27. Kh1 Kg7 28. Rf7+ Kh6 29. Qg3 Rc5 30. R1f4 Qd1+ 31. Kh2 Rh5 32. R4f6 Re1 33. Rxh7+ Kxh7 34. Qxg6+ Kh8 35. Rf8# {Black checkmated} 1-0

[Event "ICC 3 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.06.25"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TheShootah"]
[Black "Locodog"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "E76"]
[WhiteElo "1980"]
[BlackElo "1919"]
[PlyCount "27"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl "180"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 g6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 e5 7. dxe5 dxe5 8. Qxd8 Rxd8 9. Nxe5 Re8 10. Bd3 Nxe4 11. Bxe4 f6 12. Bd5+ Kh8 13. Bf7 Re7 14. Nd5 {Black resigns} 1-0

Originally posted by !~TONY~!
[b]I searched through my ICC Database and found some games where I played the four pawns, just for entertainment.

[Event "ICC 5 0"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2007.07.29"]
[Round "?"]
[White "TonyRo"]
[Black "Morfina"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "A68"]
[WhiteElo "1851"]
[BlackElo "1780"]
[PlyCount "69"]
[EventDate "2007.??.??"]
[TimeControl " ...[text shortened]...

[/b]Nice, I'm gonna go through these, peace bro.

Just looked at game one. Damn. Crazy play there, man. Although you missed an awesome mate at move 33 that would have completed a flawless game. 😉

33.Qd8+ Kg7 34.Rxf7+ Kh6 35.Qh4#

Sick game.

My favourite response to the 4 pawns is 6. .. a6
eg

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 g6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 a6

then if 7. Bd3 .. Bg4.

IMO Black retains the maximum amount of flexibility with this move order, tempting the white player to overextend themselves.

Originally posted by idioms
My favourite response to the 4 pawns is 6. .. a6
eg

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 g6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 a6

then if 7. Bd3 .. Bg4.

IMO Black retains the maximum amount of flexibility with this move order, tempting the white player to overextend themselves.

Hey, Idioms is back.

I stole your quote btw. See my profile.

Game 3886594 Dutch vs. Quirine, Samisch Variation is in progress so no comments please.

Originally posted by Dutch Defense
Game 3886594 [b]Dutch vs. Quirine, Samisch Variation is in progress so no comments please.[/b]

Quirine is one of the top 5 players on this site.

Originally posted by cmsMaster
Quirine is one of the top 5 players on this site.

why top 5 ? with only 1900 ?

Originally posted by idioms
My favourite response to the 4 pawns is 6. .. a6
eg

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 g6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 a6

then if 7. Bd3 .. Bg4.

IMO Black retains the maximum amount of flexibility with this move order, tempting the white player to overextend themselves.

I prefer similar line 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 d6 3. Nc3 g6 4. e4 Bg7 5. f4 O-O 6. Nf3 c5 7.d5 a6