What I want to know is, how did Black end up with doubled f-pawns? When I see doubled f-pawns, I think of the Caro-Kann, not the Slav. As a student and lover of defence, I vote we never allow the f-pawns to be doubled in the Slav. 😛
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1139481
Tal has fun with positions like these. ):
Originally posted by danilopIt is like this: 16. f4 Nf5 17. Bxf5 exf5 on my score sheet.
When/why did white play f4? How did your queenside pawns end up like that? I'm curious because if I were white I'd never have gone for an attack on the king there. Not without any pawn breaks and open files. Black is much more vulnerable in the other wing.
As for your "best" move, are you going to recommend a4 closing the queenside? Not sure if that would work (I don't like it after white plays b4) but there aren't many moves left.
6 edits
I think 33...Bc4! was my best move, because it is the only move in which I might be able to secure a quick draw. See the position below after 34...Bc4!
This PGN could not be parsed.
[FEN "6qk/6rp/1rp2ppR/p1Np1p2/2bP1P2/PP2P1RQ/5KPP/8 w - - "]
1. bxc4 Rb2 {and it looks like a perpetual check, for if...} 2. Kf3 dxc4
[FEN "6qk/6rp/1rp2ppR/p1Np1p2/2bP1P2/PP2P1RQ/5KPP/8 w - - "]
1. bxc4 Rb2 {and it looks like a perpetual check, for if...} 2. Kf3 dxc4
Of course, he does not have to take the bishop. But this move leaves me no worse off and probably better off. I always have trouble posting these pgn games.
Originally posted by RJHindsWhat is it with people and setting up traps? Nowadays taking a piece is dangerous. Romantic chess just refuses to die. 😲
I think 33...Bc4! was my best move, because it is the only move in which I might be able to secure a quick draw. See the position below after 34...Bc4!
[pgn]
[FEN "6qk/6rp/1rp2ppR/p1Np1p2/2bP1P2/PP2P1RQ/5KPP/8 w - - "]
1. bxc4 Rb2 {and it looks like a perpetual check, for if...} 2. Kf3 dxc4
[/pgn]
Of course, he does not have to take the bishop. B ...[text shortened]... eaves me no worse off and probably better off. I always have trouble posting these pgn games.
I'd take the piece on pure principle(in my humble opinion, it is better to not lose, then go for the win).
Since there were a couple people wondering how we reached the posted position, I decided to show everyone that I am not such a bad guy and take the trouble to type the game out to that point. I just hope I did not mess up and have to keep editing it until I get the board to appear.
White - Benjamin Caiello
Black - RJHinds
Originally posted by danilopThe idea ofgiving up the bischop for a few pawns: Bd3 Nxd3 and Rxb3 with a sreriuos counterthreat on the queenside seems to me a good one, but if it gives black more than a draw, I can' tell now.
[b]When/why did white play f4? How did your queenside pawns end up like that? I'm curious because if I were white I'd never have gone for an attack on the king there. Not without any pawn breaks and open files. Black is much more vulnerable in the other wing.
As for your "best" move, are you going to recommend a4 closing the queenside? Not sure if that would work (I don't like it after white plays b4) but there aren't many moves left.[/b
Originally posted by RJHindsThat's a great move right there. It's black's only way of punishing white for piling up all his forces on the kingside. You might get even more than a draw with it OTB, if you ask. Black's rook and passed c-pawn will be dangerous, and the queen can be activated fast too. Well spotted. 🙂
I think 33...Bc4! was my best move, because it is the only move in which I might be able to secure a quick draw. See the position below after 34...Bc4!
[pgn]
[FEN "6qk/6rp/1rp2ppR/p1Np1p2/2bP1P2/PP2P1RQ/5KPP/8 w - - "]
1. bxc4 Rb2 {and it looks like a perpetual check, for if...} 2. Kf3 dxc4
[/pgn]
Of course, he does not have to take the bishop. B ...[text shortened]... eaves me no worse off and probably better off. I always have trouble posting these pgn games.
Originally posted by RJHindsThanks for posting the game. What is unique about it is that, as I suspected, both players ended up playing on the "wrong" side of the board.
Since there were a couple people wondering how we reached the posted position, I decided to show everyone that I am not such a bad guy and take the trouble to type the game out to that point. I just hope I did not mess up and have to keep editing it until I get the board to appear.
White - Benjamin Caiello
Black - RJHinds
[pgn]
1. d4 d5 2. c4 c6 3. N ...[text shortened]... Rf3 Ba6
32. Rg3 Qg8 33. Kf2 {this is the postion where I asked you to find my best move} [/pgn]
White clearly should have focused on the queenside, with the b6 knight and the pawn on c5. 16. f4 is useful to stall black's possible counterplay on the other wing, but the rook lift 18. Rf3 is completely uncalled for. White should connect his rooks and prepare the b4 advance, with a clear advantage. His knights work much better than your bishops because of the closed position.
Since there never was anything for white on the queenside, black had nothing to fear in the middlegame. You had a comfortable game until 25... b5, which weakened your position a lot. After that, white had the opportunity to consolidate his advantage with 26. Ndc5 Bxc5 27. Nxc5 followed by 28. b3. He should then shift gears and bring his rook and queen back to the queenside - which they should never have left in the first place.I could see white winning that one rather comfortably. Instead, he chose to overcommit on a plan that was wrong to begin with.
It's a shame you didn't get the opportunity to punish him for his artificial plan over the board. 33... Bc4 would have been a delightful move to play.
2 edits
Originally posted by danilopAfter my retreat with the bishop he did shift his attention to the queenside and overcame me quickly after I made a blunder. I think he thought I would make bad defensive moves and wanted a quick win by going after my King. He is one of those Kids that likes speed chess and even though we were playing G/90, he used less than 6 minutes off his clock when I resigned on move 55. Part of that time was when I moved and he had left the board roaming around looking at other peoples games, because he was bored waiting for me to move. After the game he did say something about I had a bad bishop. I guess that was the reason he did not try to take it when he could.
Thanks for posting the game. What is unique about it is that, as I suspected, both players ended up playing on the "wrong" side of the board.
White clearly should have focused on the queenside, with the b6 knight and the pawn on c5. 16. f4 is useful to stall black's possible counterplay on the other wing, but the rook lift 18. Rf3 is completely uncalled or his artificial plan over the board. 33... Bc4 would have been a delightful move to play.
1 edit
Originally posted by danilopI looked at your idea of connecting the rooks and preparing a b4 push. I don't believe that would have worked. The best he could have done was pick up my a5 pawn at the cost of doubled rook pawns with nothing to do other than return the pawn with no real advantage. Don't forget I get to move too and even though I seem restricted, there is counterplay available to me.
Thanks for posting the game. What is unique about it is that, as I suspected, both players ended up playing on the "wrong" side of the board.
White clearly should have focused on the queenside, with the b6 knight and the pawn on c5. 16. f4 is useful to stall black's possible counterplay on the other wing, but the rook lift 18. Rf3 is completely uncalled or his artificial plan over the board. 33... Bc4 would have been a delightful move to play.
However, I do agree that 25...b5 was not the best move in the position. But unless I continued to play other not so good moves, this one move is not enough to provide him with a win. He did make those moves you suggested after that 25...b4 move, after he interposed an attacking move against my kingside. But again he could not have won without my help of making at least one more not so good move.
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RJ, can you show why there is a perpetual check in your line?
On first sight, the king can move along the 1st and 2nd rank to reach the b-file, and the rook checks are over. Maybe the dxc-pawn can come to assist, but if that one comes in action, white can move the knight.
Thanks.
Originally posted by RJHindsIt's not an immediate win; it's more of a long-term plan. In that pawn structure, white wants to play b4-b5 to create a weakness on black's queenside - either a backward c6 pawn (after bxc6) or isolated b and d pawns (if black captures on b5 with the c-pawn). After that, he can gradually increase the pressure until something cracks.
I looked at your idea of connecting the rooks and preparing a b4 push. I don't believe that would have worked. The best he could have done was pick up my a5 pawn at the cost of doubled rook pawns with nothing to do other than return the pawn with no real advantage. Don't forget I get to move too and even though I seem restricted, there is counterplay avai ...[text shortened]... But again he could not have won without my help of making at least one more not so good move.
You do have counterplay on the kingside and on the e-file, but his attack looks more straightforward.