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  1. 19 Nov '06 03:55 / 2 edits
    White to move.



    this is an adapted position taken from Tal v Smyslov 1959, the only difference between the position in the game (after 21.Kg8) and this position is that I have moved the black Knight from f6 to b6.

    [ http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1139475 ]

    Crafty gives the line: Rxa1 Kxf7 Rhe1 c5 Re4...[41m nodes : scores 3.47]

    However, I was wondering how many other "human" players would disagree. In my eyes there is a powerful imbetween move crafty missed.

    Nh6+ gxh6 Rxa1 Bg4 ...

    the idea being, to spend a tempo in order to damage blacks pawn structure. [doubled up h-pawns]

    Crafty on the other hand, seems to think this variation is marginally weaker [60m nodes: scores 3.25]

    This is only a small difference but it does mean that, had crafty beeing playing white in this game, Nh6+ would have been 2nd choice and therefore not played.

    which begs the question: who thinks crafty is right? and also, who else would play Nh6+ in this position?
  2. Subscriber huckleberryhound
    Devout Agnostic.
    19 Nov '06 04:14
    I'd take the queen, no question. . .maybe that's why i'm rated so low, but every bone in my body says "take the big kickass piece of material".
  3. 19 Nov '06 04:22
    Rxa1 Kxf7 Ne5+ Kg8 Nxc6
  4. Standard member Arrakis
    D_U_N_E
    19 Nov '06 04:30 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by huckleberryhound
    I'd take the queen, no question. . .maybe that's why i'm rated so low, but every bone in my body says "take the big kickass piece of material".
    His question isn't a matter of whether to take the queen or not. His question is should he play Nh6+ 1st, ruining Black's pawn structure and then take the queen.

    And I have an answer for him: In the game he quoted White must take the queen because after Nh6+ PxN, RxQ Black has Ne4+! ruining White's pawn structure and eliminating the black-squared bishop.

    However, by changing the position Shinidoki is asking for advice on a position that never existed. With that in mind, I wonder if he put the correct position into his chess engine? I'm not going to spend the time to chase down a "what-if" scenario.
  5. Subscriber huckleberryhound
    Devout Agnostic.
    19 Nov '06 04:48
    Originally posted by arrakis
    His question isn't a matter of whether to take the queen or not. His question is should he play Nh6+ 1st, ruining Black's pawn structure and then take the queen.

    And I have an answer for him: In the game he quoted White must take the queen because after Nh6+ PxN, RxQ Black has Ne4+! ruining White's pawn structure and eliminating the black-squared bishop. ...[text shortened]... into his chess engine? I'm not going to spend the time to chase down a "what-if" scenario.
    With respect, i knew exactly what his question was, and answered it honestly.
  6. 19 Nov '06 05:31
    Originally posted by arrakis
    His question isn't a matter of whether to take the queen or not. His question is should he play Nh6+ 1st, ruining Black's pawn structure and then take the queen.

    And I have an answer for him: In the game he quoted White must take the queen because after Nh6+ PxN, RxQ Black has Ne4+! ruining White's pawn structure and eliminating the black-squared bishop. ...[text shortened]... into his chess engine? I'm not going to spend the time to chase down a "what-if" scenario.
    the entire reason I didn't use the oringinal game (and moved the Knight) was because of Ne4+.....

    -- I don't see how solving this is any different from trying to solve any other made up position.

    and I put crafty on both positions, the one posted and after 21. kg8 of tal's game.