1. Standard memberRamned
    The Rams
    04 Sep '06
    29 Mar '09 01:26

    White to move.

    (A) Who is BETTER off? Justify with possible lines.
    (B) Identify whether or not this position is possible and justify.
  2. Standard memberSwissGambit
    Caninus Interruptus
    11 Apr '07
    29 Mar '09 02:441 edit
    Originally posted by Ramned

    White to move.

    (A) Who is BETTER off? [b]Justify with possible lines.

    (B) Identify whether or not this position is possible and justify.[/b]
    a) White has a Rook and Bishop for the Queen [slight material disadvantage], and Black's Na8 is out of play and his pieces are more passive. I'm inclined to like white, but I'm not fully sure how I'd continue. Probably 1.Be6+ Kh7 2.e5, with the idea that a Rook enters on the 7th if black takes.

    b) The position is possible in the sense that it is legal. Black made at least two pawn captures [exf6 and fxg6], but white is missing 4 units. White made at least 2 pawn captures [f3xe4xd5], but black is missing 5 units.
  3. Joined
    03 Oct '05
    05 May '09 23:371 edit
    Originally posted by Ramned

    White to move.

    (A) Who is BETTER off? [b]Justify with possible lines.

    (B) Identify whether or not this position is possible and justify.[/b]
    Is this one of those 'W is moving down the board, not up, and B is moving UP the board' is it?
  4. Joined
    23 May '08
    06 May '09 16:21
    Thus the name, attacking is what i like best

    Hm, tactics tactics..

    I agree Be6+ Kh7 e5 looks good, but, i can see no way to win from there. From black's bad knight and bizarre pawns i would almost say this was set up so it is a win for white. Just a feeling.

    Ignoring the obvious Be6+ what about a more subtle look at black's weak pawns around the king

    What of Rg1, planning Bf6!?

    If g5 h4 attacking the kingside. His immobile peices mean we can attack quicker. I could maybe give some lines but this is more intuition. Right tracks?

    Instinct is, Be6+ draws after infiltrating to repeated checks, and Rg1 might even win.
  5. Joined
    23 May '08
    06 May '09 16:253 edits
    Sorry, should talk through Bf6!? idea .

    Lets make black play a passive move to show the threats

    Rg1 a5 (black does not have many options. I wonder if the REAL solution is actually Zugwang?!)

    Bf6 and lets just make black play along
    gxf6 (if g5, h4)

    Nxf6 queen has to move

    So, Qxc5 Nxg7

    White has only a pawn right now for the rook if you count the two rooks for the queen, but, look at white's possibilities.

    Queen has to move for worry of Ne6+, Qc8 and then Ne6+ and the rook is attacked.

    Of course this is one lines, and is black playing the passive a5 but his options are limited.

    Perhaps somebody could think a better black defence, and a better player than me could try and work Zugwang into the mix??? who knows. Interesting position though

    Edit: error in analysis
  6. Joined
    09 Jun '09
    09 Jun '09 03:45
    White is lightly underpowed and is out of position but has initiative. The proposed Be6 is a poor choice as it gains no strategic advantage, allows black a free move of his King which is now in a rather weak position and worst of all it allows for the forced trade of the Bishop for the Black Knight. The one trade White is ill equipped to afford is Bishop for Knight as this gives much greater power to Black's Queen. Therefore, if White does not give its bishop an escape it becomes trapped by Black's h4 forcing the Knight/Bishop trade.

    A better move is b4. Black's right flank is weak and now must defend in one of two ways, either committing its Rook with Rb8 or more correctly with b6 now threating the pawn protecting White's Knight. An alternate move to b4 that forces the same Black response is Rc1.

    The previously discussed scenerio of:
    Bf6+ Kh7
    e5 f5 is Black's counter trapping the White bishop in a forrward position. Now White must take 2 moves with its Rooks to threaten the Black pawn at position h6 now guarded by the King.
    Rh3 Nc7 Black threatens the White bishop but exposes its pawn at position b7 by attack from the White knight which would, in turn, threaten the Black Rook.

    What does White do? If he moves Nxb7, Black counters with Rb8 threatening the White Knight and effectively pinning both of White's left flank pawns in reserve. Meanwhile, the White Bishop is still trapped and now under threat by the Black Knight. White must now withdraw its Knight with either Nd6 or Na5. The problem with Na5 is Black counters with Qxc5 now trapping the White Knight. This leaves the White Bishop with a temporary safe but a dead Knight. White is basically forced into:

    Nd6 Nxe6 as Black takes the White Bishop with his Knight. White has no choice but to take the Black Knight with his pawn:

    xe6 Qxe6 Now White is in deep trouble. It is in no position to offer a substantive attack and its central and left flank defenses have just come apart. It must defend against Qd5+ or Qd5 if White had used its other Rook first. Either way the Black Queen has just taken a commanding position now threatening both the White King and the White Knight and its protective pawn.

    My position is that the scenario of:

    Bf6+ Kh7

    ...is a death trap for White.

    Back to the original board, White's best move is either b4 or Rh3. However I will gladly play Black with this bizarre setup.

    Regarding the question of the possibility of this scenario, that has already been properly addressed.
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