Originally posted by Rajk999 I dont see anything worth trying to resolve. Maybe thats the problem with Christianity and why there are a zillion variations in doctrine... nobody listens to Christ.
You said that Jesus said nothing on a particular issue. What Jesus did say a few thousand times is that
He is the SON OF GOD AND THAT GOD IS HIS FATHER. That was good enough for Him and its good enough for me.
Im not here to resolve your manmade riddles.
Do you believe all scriptures are God-breathed or only the ones that contain the words of Christ? Why can't you give me a direct answer?
Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk If Jesus never spoke of works based salvation why do you seem to be preaching that we are saved by our works?
You don't seem to understand what divine inspiration means. 2 Tim. 3:16 says, "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness." The word "inspired" is θεόπνευστος the ...[text shortened]... trying to insult people by accusing them of lying doesn't make your opinions any more credible.
First I never preach that we are saved by works. I can guarantee you I have never used the expression 'saved by xyz". If you can show me where I said that I would by happy. So my question stands
"WHAT DID JESUS PREACH AND IS IT 'WORKS BASED SALVATION?"
Next if you are happy using your 'divine inspiration' threory to create conflict hetween Paul and Christ then thats your loss.
I maintain that you are a liar. I am not interested in who does or does not find what I say credible. People like you and cheney3 have a lot in common.
Originally posted by Rajk999 I dont see anything worth trying to resolve. Maybe thats the problem with Christianity and why there are a zillion variations in doctrine... nobody listens to Christ.
You said that Jesus said nothing on a particular issue. What Jesus did say a few thousand times is that
He is the SON OF GOD AND THAT GOD IS HIS FATHER. That was good enough for Him and its good enough for me.
Im not here to resolve your manmade riddles.
What manmade riddles. I gave you scripture references, either they are right or they are not. Maybe it's interpretation? What are your thoughts, you say one thing that seems contradictory. Is Matt right? Was Jesus born of a virgin? Can you a least answer that question?
Originally posted by leunammi What manmade riddles. I gave you scripture references, either they are right or they are not. Maybe it's interpretation? What are your thoughts, you say one thing that seems contradictory. Is Matt right? Was Jesus born of a virgin? Can you a least answer that question?
OK I dont intend to get dragged into a discussion on the rights or wrongs of the Trinity. To me that is an irrelevant doctrine about a matter clearly laid out by Christ who referred to Himself as the Son of God and repeatedly call God His Father, and that HE WAS NOT GODS EQUAL. To claim that you know more than that or that you can explain more is just plain arrogance.
Yes, Jesus was born of a virgin.
The fact that you can provide scripture for a particular church doctrine / teaching does not make it relevant or important. The JWs do that all the time to prove that they are Gods chosen people.
Originally posted by Rajk999 OK I dont intend to get dragged into a discussion on the rights or wrongs of the Trinity. To me that is an irrelevant doctrine about a matter clearly laid out by Christ who referred to Himself as the Son of God and repeatedly call God His Father, and that HE WAS NOT GODS EQUAL. To claim that you know more than that or that you can explain more is just plain ...[text shortened]... t relevant or important. The JWs do that all the time to prove that they are Gods chosen people.
To claim that you know more than that or that you can explain more is just plain arrogance.
Made no such claim, just asked a question. And my point in all this is we just don't know or fully understand God, that is all. You have a quote from Corinthians that you say implies something, Matthew has one that implies something different (there are others). Even in what appears to be a contradiction, I believe is a misunderstanding or translation problem.
God is spirit, how would we limited humans be able to relate to him unless he became a man? we couldn't. You are a son and maybe a brother, perhaps you are a father also. All of these offices (if you will) mean different things, they are unique and different at the same time and all are you, strange.. isn't it?. To be a husband would still mean something totally different than all the others. You also have a spirit which cannot be seen but is also you.
To claim that you know more than that or that you can explain more is just plain arrogance.
Made no such claim, just asked a question. And my point in all this is we just don't know or fully understand God, that is all. You have a quote from Corinthians that you say implies something, Matthew has one that implies something different (the ...[text shortened]... irit which cannot be seen but is also you.
Two gospels make Jesus God, I am good with that.
Cool. I will stay with what Jesus said as always:
- God is His Father
- God is greater than Him
Thats good enough for me
Originally posted by Rajk999 First I never preach that we are saved by works. I can guarantee you I have never used the expression 'saved by xyz". If you can show me where I said that I would by happy. So my question stands
[b]"WHAT DID JESUS PREACH AND IS IT 'WORKS BASED SALVATION?"
Next if you are happy using your 'divine inspiration' threory to create conflict hetween Paul ...[text shortened]... ho does or does not find what I say credible. People like you and cheney3 have a lot in common.[/b]
Well you have specifically claimed that faith in Jesus Christ is not necessary for salvation that that unbelievers who do good works can also be saved. You have quoted Matthew 25 to support this notion.
Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk Well you have specifically claimed that faith in Jesus Christ is not necessary for salvation that that unbelievers who do good works can also be saved. You have quoted Matthew 25 to support this notion.
You like to ask questions and have people answer them but you refuse to answer questions. Here it is again:
What did Jesus preach? Is it that you are calling 'works based salvation'?
Originally posted by Rajk999 You like to ask questions and have people answer them but you refuse to answer questions. Here it is again:
[b] What did Jesus preach? Is it that you are calling 'works based salvation'?[/b]
When Jesus started his ministry he said "Repent and believe the gospel." It seems he thought faith was also important. I wouldn't say he preached works based salvation.
Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk When Jesus started his ministry he said "Repent and believe the gospel." It seems he thought faith was also important. I wouldn't say he preached works based salvation.
"it seems he thought... " ??? You seem unsure of what Christ preached. Are you really a Christian?
Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk Well why do you now think it's important for me to be a Christian? I thought you said unbeliers can make it to Heaven?
Did I say it was important? Im commenting on your ignorance as a professed Christian, about the teachings of Christ whom you claim to believe in. Your faith is obviously dead.
Originally posted by Rajk999 Did I say it was important? Im commenting on your ignorance as a professed Christian, about the teachings of Christ whom you claim to believe in. Your faith is obviously dead.
Wow so now you can judge people's faith as well? You never cease to surprise.
Which teachings of Christ am I ignorant about?
Why do you think Christ would preach "repent and believe" if unbelievers could be saved?
Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk Wow so now you can judge people's faith as well? You never cease to surprise.
Which teachings of Christ am I ignorant about?
Why do you think Christ would preach "repent and believe" if unbelievers could be saved?
Yep... its very simple - those with dead faith believe that professing faith with their mouth will give them eternal life, while at the same time they condemn good works, calling them legalism and referring to those who practice then as being in a cult. Neither of these was preached by Jesus Christ.
Jesus condemned mouth worship and stated in no ambiguous terms that good works are essential and required for eternal life. His doctrine is the polar opposite of what you believe.
So your faith is not in Jesus Christ but in some church teaching. Therefore it is dead.
Originally posted by Rajk999 Yep... its very simple - those with dead faith believe that professing faith with their mouth will give them eternal life, while at the same time they condemn good works, calling them legalism and referring to those who practice then as being in a cult. Neither of these was preached by Jesus Christ.
Jesus condemned mouth worship and stated in no ambiguou ...[text shortened]... ieve.
So your faith is not in Jesus Christ but in some church teaching. Therefore it is dead.
Firstly tell me exactly where and how I condemned good works.
Are you saying Jesus said that faith was not necessary for salvation?
The Trinity conquers Racism
07 Dec '16 19:462 edits
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