Obviously one loves a great little conspiracy theory. And nobody seems to be spouting international conspiracy theories like Iranian leaders. The problem being that listening to Iranian leaders is like having sharp needles stuck into one's ears (much like sitting in evangelical churches, I may add).
I was just watching CNN (add that to the list of torture, by the way. What the hell is wrong with CNN reporters? Have they watched too many Hollywood film trailers or something? What a bombastic and exaggerated way of reporting: "One man is being held prisoner. Against his will. The international community...blah blah blah." And really, how the hell did the US screw up which syllables to accenturate so badly? Not even Aussies can do that!)...
Where was I?
Yeah... CNN stated two things this morning:
1. Iranian leaders say Britain and the US are behind the whole unrest.
2. The international community (does this include Lichtenstein, I find myself pondering) condemns the holding of prisoners by Iranian authorities without them having lawyers (And I find myself wondering if the US mumbled anything along those lines...).
Sticking to one, what you all think?
I mean, it's not like the US, Israel or Britain's rhetoric towards Iran has been unbiased the last...uh... 40 years or so. And the US did finance the Iraquee war against Iran in the 80's.
And the US did finance various "revolutions" in the former Soviet block (like the orange revolution).
And the British are always sneaking about (unless their spies are having gay sex in toilets, obviously).
The problem so far, for Iran, is that the only proof they've got of foreign meddling (not, by the way, that I'm suggesting the election was fair, that's not what this thread is about) seems to be the confessions of prisoners who are being held without representation. Which means their confessions are worth faeces in a jar.
I wonder, on a side track to do with point 2, if the international community does more than condemn Iran for the holding of these prisoners, what perspective that shines on this discussion, for the US was only condemned, and nothing else, for exactly the same.
Any ideas? Is it really just paranoid delusions? What with a major US offensive in Afghanistan for no apparant reason, is this a case of just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you.
Originally posted by shavixmirIt's only a delusion if you believe something that is clearly untrue or impossibly unlikely.
Obviously one loves a great little conspiracy theory. And nobody seems to be spouting international conspiracy theories like Iranian leaders. The problem being that listening to Iranian leaders is like having sharp needles stuck into one's ears (much like sitting in evangelical churches, I may add).
I was just watching CNN (add that to the list of tortu ...[text shortened]... s this a case of just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you.
It's not impossible that US/UK are being sneaky -- we have been in the past.
But I also don't think the Iranian leaders believe a lot of what they are alleging. They are just trying to manipulate public opinion so they can keep a firm grip on power, and the US/UK are convenient bogeymen.
Originally posted by spruce112358Does anybody seriously doubt that this is exactly what's going on?
But I also don't think the Iranian leaders believe a lot of what they are alleging. They are just trying to manipulate public opinion so they can keep a firm grip on power, and the US/UK are convenient bogeymen.
What caused their unrest is the yearning of some of their people for reform and a perception, true or not, that the government suppressed the will of the people in the election. Everything else is hot air.
Originally posted by sh76If it was any other President I would not be surprised if the US was meddling. But Obama? Mister no more civilian casualties in Afghanistan?
Does anybody seriously doubt that this is exactly what's going on?
What caused their unrest is the yearning of some of their people for reform and a perception, true or not, that the government suppressed the will of the people in the election. Everything else is hot air.
Originally posted by shavixmirA very fun theory. Unfortunately, I must debunk it.
Obviously one loves a great little conspiracy theory. And nobody seems to be spouting international conspiracy theories like Iranian leaders. The problem being that listening to Iranian leaders is like having sharp needles stuck into one's ears (much like sitting in evangelical churches, I may add).
I was just watching CNN (add that to the list of tortu ...[text shortened]... s this a case of just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you.
1. Iranian leaders say Britain and the US are behind the whole unrest.
And Islamic Jihad says the Mossad is behind 9/11. The Mossad is an evil bunch of jerkbags, certainly, but really? 9/11? Same with this. Iran has many good things about it, and the US and Britain not really, but really?
2. The international community (does this include Lichtenstein, I find myself pondering) condemns the holding of prisoners by Iranian authorities without them having lawyers (And I find myself wondering if the US mumbled anything along those lines...).
And this supports the assertion because ....
I mean, it's not like the US, Israel or Britain's rhetoric towards Iran has been unbiased the last...uh... 40 years or so. And the US did finance the Iraquee war against Iran in the 80's.
If you'll recall, the US financed both sides. It did not do it because of ideological agreement with either, but because of realpolitik. The US has little to gain from another war like this right now.
And the US did finance various "revolutions" in the former Soviet block (like the orange revolution).
A dark period in the country's history. Of course, the US also funded Saddam. Look how that "revolution" ended up.
I wonder, on a side track to do with point 2, if the international community does more than condemn Iran for the holding of these prisoners, what perspective that shines on this discussion, for the US was only condemned, and nothing else, for exactly the same.
Are you referring to Roxana Saberi? Because she was a CIA agent.
Any ideas? Is it really just paranoid delusions? What with a major US offensive in Afghanistan for no apparant reason, is this a case of just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you.
No apparent reason?? There's a reason all right. And I can compress said reason to six letters: E-M-P-I-R-E
Originally posted by shavixmirComing soon to a converted mosque near you, Iranian Evangelism 2.0, where the vengeance that was going to target Israeli's and push them all the way into the Mediterranean will now be sublimated into an all encompassing concern that will help nationalise the countries guilt, thereby staying true to their core belief, relentlessly on mission, to help everyone turn off their TV to help excise the influence of that great satan, the Western world wide webby web of consumer driven, multigasmic experiences, which would so easily if it were allowed to proceed unchecked, quickly devolve into longer and longer bouts of introspective haranguing
Obviously one loves a great little conspiracy theory. And nobody seems to be spouting international conspiracy theories like Iranian leaders. The problem being that listening to Iranian leaders is like having sharp needles stuck into one's ears (much like sitting in evangelical churches, I may add).
I was just watching CNN (add that to the list of tortu ...[text shortened]... s this a case of just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean they're not after you.
maybe the Iranian people didn't LIKE the indications the election was rigged ...
maybe the Iranian people didn't LIKE the background to this in recent Iranian electoral history .... such as the removal from ballots of several thousand opposition candidates a few years ago (2000?) ....
maybe the Iranian people don't LIKE a theocratic executive (Khameini) with so much power ...
maybe the leaders in Iran fomented the unreset ON THEIR OWN ...
Originally posted by zeeblebotYes. and my general question is, considering the US and the UK's behaviour in recent history (the last 40 years) and the accusations of Iran, maybe they didn't...
maybe the Iranian people didn't LIKE the indications the election was rigged ...
maybe the Iranian people didn't LIKE the background to this in recent Iranian electoral history .... such as the removal from ballots of several thousand opposition candidates a few years ago (2000?) ....
maybe the Iranian people don't LIKE a theocratic executive (Khamei ...[text shortened]... i) with so much power ...
maybe the leaders in Iran fomented the unreset ON THEIR OWN ...
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Originally posted by shavixmirI find it likely that we are witnessing calculated strategy from the Iranian establishment to try to deflect interest from their own problems (whether the election was fair or not). It seems logical that many of those protesting have 'western' sympathies, so there's the obvious link.
Yes. and my general question is, considering the US and the UK's behaviour in recent history (the last 40 years) and the accusations of Iran, maybe they didn't...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it the BBC that have purportedly been the 'real' perpetrators of unrest. Perhaps they weren't too happy about the undercover BBC reporters who were trying to remain in Tehran after they had been told to bugger off so that they couldn't publicise the events...