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Originally posted by jareyesMost feminist authors totally denounce pornography as it entrenches sexual inequality, objectifies women as sexual ornaments, which serves only to uphold the established male hierarchy.
I catch your point... here is where I am heading
"Erotic experience is a human good. Mature, consenting adults should be able to explore the erotic realm freely, without outside interference. Pornography is illicit and destructive. But what is the real difference between the erotic and the pornographic? Is there a bright line? In our attempts to regul ...[text shortened]... lts?" (Anne Ashbaugh)
Sontag has also a very interesting point on it.
What do you think?
Pornography is not just an observed experience whereby our lusts are gratified, but allows for the continued enslavement and exploitation of women as chattel, who are expected to perform to the needs and desires of the male gaze and are only truly satisfied by male penetration which further extends the boundaries of domination of males over females.
If pornography is art and art articulates a voice, then that voice legitimises actions that are at odds with the intrinsic sovereignty that all citizens should have a right to enjoy.
Thats my understanding of feminist argument against pornography and as a rational more mature person I can understand the logic and the ramifications those views hold as opposed to the non critical excitement at seeing pornography for the first time as a teenager.
Is eroticism any different? Is it something that introduces a thought or feeling that is not as immediately as arresting as pornography but that if contemplated long enough would lead to a similar conclusion?
Originally posted by kmax87erotic art is just more subtle than pornography. porn is crack whereas erotic art is a fine french wine. porn is refined sugar where erotic art is an apple. but also, porn is this sort of low-brow eroticism run amok. it is seen as an entirely different thing because it is so out of control - like refined sugar or crack.
Most feminist authors totally denounce pornography as it entrenches sexual inequality, objectifies women as sexual ornaments, which serves only to uphold the established male hierarchy.
Pornography is not just an observed experience whereby our lusts are gratified, but allows for the continued enslavement and exploitation of women as chattel, who are expe ...[text shortened]... rresting as pornography but that if contemplated long enough would lead to a similar conclusion?
Originally posted by jareyesYou don't have to draw a specific conceptual line to recognize the validity of distinction.
I catch your point... here is where I am heading
"Erotic experience is a human good. Mature, consenting adults should be able to explore the erotic realm freely, without outside interference. Pornography is illicit and destructive. But what is the real difference between the erotic and the pornographic? Is there a bright line? In our attempts to regul ...[text shortened]... lts?" (Anne Ashbaugh)
Sontag has also a very interesting point on it.
What do you think?
Does the existence of dawn or twilight invalidate the concepts of night and day?
Originally posted by Pawnokeyhole"...Ugo Volli has analyzed a phenomenon that he called “pornokitsch” and which overlaps, as I would affirm, more or less exactly with Japanese kitsch of innocence. Volli’s formula is simple: “At the moment man makes of sex an aesthetic or scientific thing there is no reason to be ashamed of sex.” Pornography as art (or pornography as science) is innocent because it has become pornokitsch."
But if, boringly, anything can be considered a work of art, then pornography can also be considered art. What an intellectual breakthrough!
( The Aesthetics of Frozen Dreams (with a Note on Mariko Mori): http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:jbeKN4k9tj4J:www.contempaesthetics.org/newvolume/articles/386-0-wabi-kitsch.doc+%22pornography+as+science%22&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3)
pornography
----n : creative activity (writing or pictures or films etc.) of no
--------literary or artistic value other than to stimulate sexual
--------desire
Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913)
If it has no artistic value, then surely, it cannot be referred to as art. Although, webster can be wrong. I consider porn to be beautiful and inspiring (well, some of it, at least).
A vagina by any other name would smell as fishy.
Originally posted by stockenA toothpick can also be beautiful and inspiring.
[b]pornography
----n : creative activity (writing or pictures or films etc.) of no
--------literary or artistic value other than to stimulate sexual
--------desire
Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary (1913)
If it has no artistic value, then surely, it cannot be referred to as art. Although, webster can be wrong. I consider por ...[text shortened]... nd inspiring (well, some of it, at least).
A vagina by any other name would smell as fishy.[/b]
I think A toothoick by itself, in a 500 sq. ft. room with brown ceramic tiles and dimly lit white walls, seated upon a pedestal encased in bulletproof glass, and sectioned off from the prying eyes and hands of the casual observer by red, velvet, rope, would qualify as the best of anything and everything art has given us.
Yeah... *fantasizes about toothpicks*
*drool*
Originally posted by TetsujinWonderful satire of phallocracy disguised as aesthetic utilitarianism...splendid auto-deconstruction...waffle waffle...
I think A toothoick by itself, in a 500 sq. ft. room with brown ceramic tiles and dimly lit white walls, seated upon a pedestal encased in bulletproof glass, and sectioned off from the prying eyes and hands of the casual observer by red, velvet, rope, would qualify as the best of anything and everything art has given us.
Originally posted by kmax87
male penetration which further extends the boundaries of domination of males over females.
This is perhaps a little off topic but the above snippet is, in my view, the root of societies confusion regarding sexual expression.
Why do we see male penetration = dominance.
Regards
Originally posted by shavixmirOoh, your powers of deduction are exceptional. I can't allow you to waste them here when there are so many crimes going unsolved at this very moment. Go, go, for the good of the city!
I love naked bodies.
I think it's only porn when it's got no artistic merit to it what so ever.