Originally posted by AThousandYoung"But that doesn't mean Skippy Brand Smooth Variety Peanut Butter is a substitute for peanut butter. Nor is "a house on the outskirts" a substitute for housing."
OK, I'll accept that "a house in the center of Helsinki" might be a "so-called positional good".
Organic peanut butter probably is too.
But that doesn't mean Skippy Brand Smooth Variety Peanut Butter is a substitute for peanut butter. Nor is "a house on the outskirts" a substitute for housing.
T-bone steak is a substitute for peanut butter.
Originally posted by normbenignNo, there are zero alternatives to living somewhere except dying.
Of course it is. You've pointed out that we have to live somewhere. There are lots of alternatives. Most people don't live the same place for more than 6 o 7 years.
There are many alternatives to living in any one place, but not to living SOMEWHERE.
Originally posted by normbenignYes! Thank you. A substitute has to be something other than what it is substituting.
"But that doesn't mean Skippy Brand Smooth Variety Peanut Butter is a substitute for peanut butter. Nor is "a house on the outskirts" a substitute for housing."
T-bone steak is a substitute for peanut butter.
Food is not a substitute for food. Housing is not a substitute for housing.
A steak is a substitute for peanut butter. A condominium in the city is a substitute for a mansion on a rural estate.
Originally posted by moon1969Just not an indicator. My 401k is happy too.
If the government is not propping up the stock market, then do you think the performance of the stock market is some kind of indicator? I know I am glad my 401K recovered. Big time. I am very glad we did not elect McCain or Romney.
Originally posted by sh76So, you do not want government controlling economic forces and then you b#@ch when old fashioned capitalism, supply and demand, creates a rise in property values.
Yup, looks like things are (finally) picking up.
I can't say I'm overly happy with the surge in housing prices, though. Housing prices were wayyy inflated in the mid 2000s. After the bubble burst, I was kind of hoping that housing prices would stay more in line with what regular people could afford without gimmick mortgages.
It's not Obama's fault of cour ...[text shortened]... ut I don't think that double digit home price jumps are necessarily something to celebrate.
Originally posted by AThousandYoungJust matters of degree. You ever eat some of that government surplus peanut butter. The difference between that and Skippy is like an ocean front condo, and a South Side Chicago high rise project.
Yes! Thank you. A substitute has to be something other than what it is substituting.
Food is not a substitute for food. Housing is not a substitute for housing.
A steak is a substitute for peanut butter. A condominium in the city is a substitute for a mansion on a rural estate.
The same commodity can be alternatives to lesser quality in that same commodity.
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http://weburbanist.com/2007/09/28/urban-camping-subversive-city-living-from-times-square-to-the-car-tent/
Ultimately they were shooed away by the police, but not before sipping on hot chocolate and taking a few pictures.
Shooed away by police? Why?
Am I allowed to move on to the sidewalk in front of someone's house?
What if I decided I absolutely HAD to live right on top of Marilyn Monroe's star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. Could I do that legally?
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Originally posted by normbenignYes, one quality of a commodity can be an alternative to or substitute for a different quality, but it cannot be an alternative to the commodity itself.
Just matters of degree. You ever eat some of that government surplus peanut butter. The difference between that and Skippy is like an ocean front condo, and a South Side Chicago high rise project.
The same commodity can be alternatives to lesser quality in that same commodity.
Grade A eggs are not a substitute for eggs.
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FACT:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upper_Class
The main distinguishing feature of upper class is its ability to derive enormous incomes from wealth through techniques such as money management and investmenting, rather than engaging in wage-labor or salaried employment
Capitalism is where rich people get paid for not working.
Originally posted by AThousandYoungOrganic peanut butter is definitely not a positional good, because the supply of organic peanut butter is not fundamentally limited in the same way that land is. A factory making organic peanut butter can easily double output if demand increases, but you can't duplicate a house in the center of Helsinki in the same spot.
OK, I'll accept that "a house in the center of Helsinki" might be a "so-called positional good".
Organic peanut butter probably is too.
But that doesn't mean Skippy Brand Smooth Variety Peanut Butter is a substitute for peanut butter. Nor is "a house on the outskirts" a substitute for housing.
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Originally posted by AThousandYoung"Substitute" (in an economic sense) does not mean that the quality is the same. It means that it's a possible alternative. Any kind of food is a substitute for any kind of other food (as long as you're not allergic etc.). Price and preferences determine which of the available options one chooses. Someone who likes organic peanut butter a lot may still opt for regular peanut butter if the organic version is ten times more expensive, for example.
Yes, one quality of a commodity can be an alternative to or substitute for a different quality, but it cannot be an alternative to the commodity itself.
Grade A eggs are not a substitute for eggs.
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Originally posted by KazetNagorraYes, any kind of food is an substitute for "any other kind of food". But just because one subdivision of a good can substitute for another subdivision doesn't mean there is a substitute for the good itself.
"Substitute" (in an economic sense) does not mean that the quality is the same. It means that it's a possible alternative. Any kind of food is a substitute for any kind of other food (as long as you're not allergic etc.).
There is no substitute for food except starvation.
With respect to housing, I am not really concerned about mansions or penthouses in Manhattan.
I am concerned about the difference between sleeping on the street and sleeping in a bedroom. There's no "positional good" effect going on with respect to housing in that sense.
I have serious doubts that it's legal to make one's home on most public property despite what no1 is saying. However, a tent or lean-to in the park is an alternative to housing. If it's legal. But I doubt it is.
Originally posted by no1marauderThe only way land provides income is by someone else taking possession of it.
What is the difference? If somebody tries to take your stock certificate, the police will arrest them because ownership entitles you to exclusive use (that's what it means to "own" something). Land isn't treated any differently from any other owned asset.
Originally posted by AThousandYoungThey get paid for their money working, not for not working. A man with a shovel may be able to dig a grave in a half a day. With a tea spoon it may take him a month. With a back hoe he can do it in 10 minutes.
FACT:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upper_Class
The main distinguishing feature of upper class is its ability to derive enormous incomes from wealth through techniques such as money management and investmenting, rather than engaging in wage-labor or salaried employment
Capitalism is where rich people get paid for not working.
The difference between a backhoe, a shovel, and a teaspoon is capital.