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Debates Forum

Debates Forum

  1. 14 Jul '15 00:11
    I've been thinking about this lately. Most all major debates are never going to be settled. Are Conservatives ruining America, or is it Liberals? Doesn't matter how bad things get, Conservatives will blame Liberals and Liberals will blame conservatives.

    In our lifetime, the Y2K problem was interesting in that in the late 90s there was heated debate. Some said it was The End of the World as We Know It, others that it would be nothing but a few minor glitches. Heated debates ensued complete with foul language. The interesting part is that this was one debate where one side was proved right and the other proved wrong. You can still find some of the debate if you're good enough with google.

    Was anyone around and engaged in that debate or have memories of it?
  2. Subscriber no1marauder
    It's Nice to Be Nice
    14 Jul '15 01:02
    Originally posted by techsouth
    I've been thinking about this lately. Most all major debates are never going to be settled. Are Conservatives ruining America, or is it Liberals? Doesn't matter how bad things get, Conservatives will blame Liberals and Liberals will blame conservatives.

    In our lifetime, the Y2K problem was interesting in that in the late 90s there was heated debate. ...[text shortened]... good enough with google.

    Was anyone around and engaged in that debate or have memories of it?
    I was but I can't seem to archive any of my computer records before January 1, 2000 for some strange reason.
  3. Standard member sh76
    Civis Americanus Sum
    14 Jul '15 01:13 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by techsouth
    I've been thinking about this lately. Most all major debates are never going to be settled. Are Conservatives ruining America, or is it Liberals? Doesn't matter how bad things get, Conservatives will blame Liberals and Liberals will blame conservatives.

    In our lifetime, the Y2K problem was interesting in that in the late 90s there was heated debate. ...[text shortened]... good enough with google.

    Was anyone around and engaged in that debate or have memories of it?
    As most of us here I'm sure, I remember it well. The debates were fierce years before the event, but in the last days and months, most people were convinced that little, of anything, was going to happen. My mother filled her basement with bottled water, canned tuna and flashlight batteries on the "better safe than sorry" theory and I well remember teasing her about it for months before 1/1/00.

    On the positive side, she made a lot of tuna casserole in the first half of 2000.
  4. 14 Jul '15 01:27
    Originally posted by sh76 to techsouth
    As most of us here I'm sure, I remember it well. The debates were fierce years before the event, but in the last days and months, most people were convinced that little, of anything, was going to happen. My mother filled her basement with bottled water, canned tuna and flashlight batteries on the "better safe than sorry" theory and I well remember ...[text shortened]... re 1/1/00.

    On the positive side, she made a lot of tuna casserole in the first half of 2000.
    After the Axis invaded the USSR on 22 June 1941, the Soviet authorities instituted strict rationing.
    In Leningrad someone noticed that a few luxury food items (such as caviar and crab meat),
    originally destined for export to the West, were not being rationed. He reckoned that if
    Leningrad became besieged and food grew scarce, then money would have no value.
    So he decided to spend his life savings in buying as much caviar, crab meat, etc. as possible.
    During the terrible winter of 1941-42, when thousands of Leningraders were dying every
    day of starvation, he was able to survive in relative safety. His intutition had paid off.
  5. Standard member RJHinds
    The Near Genius
    14 Jul '15 03:29 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by techsouth
    I've been thinking about this lately. Most all major debates are never going to be settled. Are Conservatives ruining America, or is it Liberals? Doesn't matter how bad things get, Conservatives will blame Liberals and Liberals will blame conservatives.

    In our lifetime, the Y2K problem was interesting in that in the late 90s there was heated debate. ...[text shortened]... good enough with google.

    Was anyone around and engaged in that debate or have memories of it?
    My youngest son, who has a genius I.Q, 187, was still in High School at that time and we had a computer mainly for him for his school work. He spent a lot of time on the internet at that time, but I did very little with the computer then. I remember he had a patch for it so that it would not effect our computer. So he wasn't worried about it after that since he reasoned everyone could get a patch until they got new computers and upgraded software.
  6. 14 Jul '15 21:57
    Originally posted by techsouth
    I've been thinking about this lately. Most all major debates are never going to be settled. Are Conservatives ruining America, or is it Liberals? Doesn't matter how bad things get, Conservatives will blame Liberals and Liberals will blame conservatives.

    In our lifetime, the Y2K problem was interesting in that in the late 90s there was heated debate. ...[text shortened]... good enough with google.

    Was anyone around and engaged in that debate or have memories of it?
    I remember it well, and I remember a lot of people doing more than I did to prepare. I have great respect for preppers, regardless of what they are prepping for, because if the worst doesn't happen, they can still use what they've saved. When the worst does happen, the sorry fools who never believe anything will happen will be the first to die in food riots.
  7. 17 Jul '15 09:28
    Originally posted by normbenign
    I remember it well, and I remember a lot of people doing more than I did to prepare. I have great respect for preppers, regardless of what they are prepping for, because if the worst doesn't happen, they can still use what they've saved. When the worst does happen, the sorry fools who never believe anything will happen will be the first to die in food riots.
    If you actually believed your own argument, you would be a prepper too.
  8. 17 Jul '15 09:31
    Originally posted by techsouth
    The interesting part is that this was one debate where one side was proved right and the other proved wrong.
    But which side? Do you realise that the people who got it right were the people who said 'if we don't do anything, many systems will fail'? Most major systems did not fail, because we did something.
  9. Standard member Agerg
    The 'edit'or
    17 Jul '15 11:07
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    My youngest son, who has a genius I.Q, 187, was still in High School at that time and we had a computer mainly for him for his school work. He spent a lot of time on the internet at that time, but I did very little with the computer then. I remember he had a patch for it so that it would not effect our computer. So he wasn't worried about it after that since he reasoned everyone could get a patch until they got new computers and upgraded software.
    He "got a patch for it"!?? Your IQ:187 son reasoned that every piece of software that naively stores only the last 2 digits of a 4 digit date would have been remedied by this one measly little patch!?
  10. 17 Jul '15 13:40
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    But which side? Do you realise that the people who got it right were the people who said 'if we don't do anything, many systems will fail'? Most major systems did not fail, because we did something.
    I don't recall that being a major fissure in the debate. From the mid 90s I don't recall anyone suggesting we do nothing.

    The bitter debate, complete with cursing was between those who thought that based on what was being done, the rollover would be no big deal and those that thought it was already too late to prevent "the end of the world as we know it". Those in the first group were called "Pollyannas". The second group predicted the power grid would fail, the banks would fail, the phone system would fail, cars wouldn't start, planes would crash, etc.

    Go back and find some of the discussions. I don't think you'll find anyone who suggested we do nothing.
  11. 17 Jul '15 14:01
    Originally posted by techsouth
    I've been thinking about this lately. Most all major debates are never going to be settled. Are Conservatives ruining America, or is it Liberals? Doesn't matter how bad things get, Conservatives will blame Liberals and Liberals will blame conservatives.

    In our lifetime, the Y2K problem was interesting in that in the late 90s there was heated debate. ...[text shortened]... good enough with google.

    Was anyone around and engaged in that debate or have memories of it?
    The threat is not Y2K I tell ya, it's global warming.

    We are all gonna die!!
  12. Standard member RJHinds
    The Near Genius
    17 Jul '15 20:24 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Agerg
    He "got a patch for it"!?? Your IQ:187 son reasoned that every piece of software that naively stores only the last 2 digits of a 4 digit date would have been remedied by this one measly little patch!?
    I didn't understand it like my son, but as I understood it, the patch program was to correct the computer processor clock or the main clock and date that would control the time and date for Microsoft Windows. I think that was the main problem, but I could be wrong. But anyway I trusted that he knew what he was saying and so I wasn't worried about it either. Whether or not there was any additional problems with other software that this would not correct, I am not sure. But anyway we never had any problems.

    He used to fix computer for other people and one time a friend of my wife got him to fix a problem with the computer system at the real estate company she worked for because the computer company they called was unable to fix it. The owner of the real estate company offered him a job, but he was still in high school at the time and was not interested in working for them anyway.
  13. 18 Jul '15 13:07 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    But which side? Do you realise that the people who got it right were the people who said 'if we don't do anything, many systems will fail'? Most major systems did not fail, because we did something.
    No, most major systems did not fail because by the time the press, politicians and middle managers started panicking, stockpiling toilet paper, and buying Y2K-proof cable ties, us programmers had already done something about it years before. I know this, because I was one of the people doing the solving, several years before Y2K started appearing in the news and my managers (who had, those years before, whinged about my measures to fix Y2K) started bugging me about doing something about "this Y2K thing". Many eyes were rolled.

    The debate was between a load of panic-mongering ignoramuses, and those who knew the problem was already mostly solved by the time the debate happened.
  14. 21 Jul '15 21:02
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    If you actually believed your own argument, you would be a prepper too.
    I am, just not as extreme as some.
  15. Subscriber Kewpie
    since 1-Feb-07
    23 Jul '15 08:52
    Originally posted by Shallow Blue
    No, most major systems did not fail because by the time the press, politicians and middle managers started panicking, stockpiling toilet paper, and buying Y2K-proof cable ties, us programmers had already done something about it years before. I know this, because I was one of the people doing the solving, several years before Y2K started appearing ...[text shortened]... muses, and those who knew the problem was already mostly solved by the time the debate happened.
    Australia had a big rewrite program going, and almost everyone had their old code replaced by the expected date. One exception was our biggest health fund, which sent out a mail shot to half a million people with strange dates on it which made a nonsense of the contents. As a result they had to do a second mail shot 24 hours later, blowing their communication budget for months. There were a few other minor things, like security codes which had to be manually over-ruled for a week, but generally the programmers got it all done in time.

    Management where I worked didn't panic, the panics were all at the lower levels where people didn't understand the nature of the problem, or were fooled by a disaster-preaching public media campaign.