30 Apr 03
In light of the spread of the SARS virus, could this virus be blamed on our drug culture these days.
It's a well known fact that virusses mutate an evolve (the common flu is a good example).
Are doctors prescribing drugs too easily these days? We use supplements instead of eating right and getting excercise. Virusses evolve because we get prescribed anti-biotics too easily and the virus needs to then evolve in order to invect the host.
Nowadays there are dozens of different drugs every type of illness. People today are taking drugs to stop the side effects incurred by using other drugs.
Isn't there something wrong here.
30 Apr 03
I have this theory that the use of copious amounts of bleach in the kitchen, coupled with anti-bacterial washing liquid, anti-bacterial chopping boards, etc. and obsessive levels of hygeine leads to ineffective immune systems. Because people are not exposed to germs from an early age and don't develop antibodies.
"A bit of muck does you good" should be a proverb if it isn't already.
Then again, my theory could be completely wrong 😉
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by CrowleyI take your point, but actually the SARS virus can't be blamed so much on the drug culture, because antibiotics don't kill viruses, they kill bacteria, and it's bacteria that evolve and mutate against antibiotics, not viruses...
In light of the spread of the SARS virus, could this virus be blamed on our drug culture these days.
It's a well known fact that virusses mutate an evolve (the common flu is a good example).
Are doctors prescribing drugs too easily these days? We use supplements instead of eating right and getting excercise. Virusses evolve because we get prescribed a ...[text shortened]... gs to stop the side effects incurred by using other drugs.
Isn't there something wrong here.
The fact that we prescribe too many antibiotics definitely has an effect on bacterial infections becoming more virulent and difficult to deal with, but I think the only suitable way to cure/insure against a virus is to have the antibodies for it (I think, please correct me if this is wrong).
Joe
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by kyngjAre you sure about antibiotics?
I take your point, but actually the SARS virus can't be blamed so much on the drug culture, because antibiotics don't kill viruses, they kill bacteria, and it's bacteria that evolve and mutate against antibiotics, not viruses...
The fact that we prescribe too many antibiotics definitely has an effect on bacterial infections becoming more virulent and di ...[text shortened]... t a virus is to have the antibodies for it (I think, please correct me if this is wrong).
Joe
According to me, antibiotics are a weakened virus, given to a person showing symptons of being infected by this virus. The body then creates more antibodies to fight the virus - killing the weakened virus easily and therefore leaving more antibodies to fight the real culprit.
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by kyngjJoe
I take your point, but actually the SARS virus can't be blamed so much on the drug culture, because antibiotics don't kill viruses, they kill bacteria, and it's bacteria that evolve and mutate against antibiotics, not viruses...
The fact that we prescribe too many antibiotics definitely has an effect on bacterial infections becoming more virulent and di ...[text shortened]... t a virus is to have the antibodies for it (I think, please correct me if this is wrong).
Joe
You are correct. Though drugs such as AZT for the HIV virus attack (probably the wrong word) proteins on the surface of the virus that allow the virus to interact with human white blood cells.
(In very general terms) Vaccines for virus use the human immune reaction to create antibodies.
-trekkie
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by CrowleyThat is totally wrong.... I am not sure where you got your information from but I would either find a better source or reread your old text books.
Are you sure about antibiotics?
According to me, antibiotics are a weakened virus, given to a person showing symptons of being infected by this virus. The body then creates more antibodies to fight the virus - killing the weakened virus easily and therefore leaving more antibodies to fight the real culprit.
-trekkie
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by CrowleyI believe a vaccine is a weakened virus. Once injected your body fights it and builds up an immunity, so if you later encounter the real virus your body is more prepared to fight it off.
Are you sure about antibiotics?
According to me, antibiotics are a weakened virus, given to a person showing symptons of being infected by this virus. The body then creates more antibodies to fight the virus - killing the weakened virus easily and therefore leaving more antibodies to fight the real culprit.
I could be wrong though...
Marc
30 Apr 03
2 edits
Originally posted by mwmillerA vaccine for the flu virus looks like the flu but does not behave like the flu. All of the outer protiens that interact with other cells are present but it is "deactivated", which basically means that it can not replicate its RNA. Our immune system learns to recognise cells with the same outer protiens as the virus as foreign and deals with them.
I believe a vaccine is a weakened virus. Once injected your body fights it and builds up an immunity, so if you later encounter the real virus your body is more prepared to fight it off.
I could be wrong though...
Marc
So when the real virus comes along our immune system is "not tricked" into thinking the virus is suppose to be there, therefore it reacts quickly not allowing the virus to overwelm our defenses.
Scientist are just working out, what might seem like common sense when you think about it, that our immune system is very powerful in fighting infections (bacterial or viruses) it just need an alert system for the more virulent infections.
-trekkie
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by trekkieAah...
That is totally wrong.... I am not sure where you got your information from but I would either find a better source or reread your old text books.
-trekkie
Got this definition of a Wisonsin University site:
Antibiotics: antimicrobial agents produced by microorganisms that kill or inhibit other microorganisms. This is the microbiologist's definition. A more broadened definition of an antibiotic includes any chemical of natural origin (from any type of cell) which has the effect to kill or inhibit the growth of other types cells. Since most clinically-useful antibiotics are produced by microorganisms and are used to kill or inhibit infectious Bacteria.
Just shows you, every day you can learn something new.
The usefullness of the forum being displayed yet again.
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by VargI think this is very true. We have a friend with a little 3 year old girl ,two weeks younger than our eldest daughter. Every day her mother would put all her teethers and hard toys in the dishwasher to disinfect, whereas we did not.
I have this theory that the use of copious amounts of bleach in the kitchen, coupled with anti-bacterial washing liquid, anti-bacterial chopping boards, etc. and obsessive levels of hygeine leads to ineffective immune systems. Because people are not exposed to germs from an early age and don't develop antibodies.
"A bit of muck does you good" should be a proverb if it isn't already.
Then again, my theory could be completely wrong 😉
This little girl and our eldest go to the same art class, Kindermusic and play together. She seems to be forever getting colds and tummy bugs but our eldest is hardly ill at all.
We definitely think 'a bit of muck does you good' - how else is the immune system supposed to train itself?
30 Apr 03
1 edit
Originally posted by VargVarg
I have this theory that the use of copious amounts of bleach in the kitchen, coupled with anti-bacterial washing liquid, anti-bacterial chopping boards, etc. and obsessive levels of hygeine leads to ineffective immune systems. Because people a ...[text shortened]... sn't already.
Then again, my theory could be completely wrong 😉
You are right there is a clear link, sorry i do not have references on me, between hyper clean enviroiments and asthmatics. Whilst it may not be the only cause, it is certainly highly significant.
Asthma is caused by an over active immune system reaction to foriegn particles in the lungs. Mucus is formed to line the brocils (speelling ?, i mean the little air tubes in the lungs leading to the air sacs) a natural immune reaction, however in the case of asthma the reactions is serve and probably not required (based on the reaction of a non-asthmatics immune system).
Lesson to be learnt, asthma is not going to go away totally from the popoulation. However the modern hygene routines do not allow our childrens immune sytsem to develop normally and learn when (and when not) to react. Let your kids play in dirt, do not stop the seemingly constant highway between dirt and a toddlers mouth, expose your kid to others kids yes they will get sick but the body needs (to some extent) childhood disease for the immune system to develop.
-trekkie
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by CrowleyVery nice, read my last post.
New health warning:
"Overprotecting your kids may be harmful to their health, let the kids muck about".
Virusses must be queueing outside Michael Jackson's door.
Although him dangling his son out that window in Germany might actually help the kid in future...
30 Apr 03
Originally posted by CrowleyCrowley
trekkie, you got some good info. Are you in the medical profession or something?
I do not have a medical degree, i am a (bio)medical engineer currently trying to finish my phd. I have a working knowledge of most medical sciences simply for the work i do. My ojb involves speaking to the doctors in their jargon translating that into engineering jargon, then directing other engineers or doing it myself to build a device, analyses data what ever is required to get the information back to the doctor in a form they understand.
i have worked on respitory monitors for neo natal babies, mamograms for better detection of the early stages of cancer, physiological monitoring of head trumor patients, hearing aid design (my phd topic), various projects realted to the auditory brain stem response. Besdies my phd topic the other projects i had limited input or time working on.
when i finish my phd i want to work as an academic but also have my own consultancy business, develoiping signal processing for research inmedical applications. i could do anything, or find right people to do it for me, from desinging of new sensors, putting together off the shlef monitors for a study, to detailed data analysis. all these skills are not taught in medical school 🙂
So that is my background and hopefully future.
-trekkie