I didn't want to hijack the culture of death and the culture of death thread, so I thought I'd start a new one instead.
Ivanhoe said:
Do they realise that rebelling against God also means rebelling against love, justice and peace ?
I don't think that's a very fair statement. Years back I was a believer, attended church, went to a christian college, the whole deal. I started having doubts about my belief, but the belief didn't just go away like that. I rebelled against God at first, to be honest I was downright pissed at Him. And after a lot of soul searching and open minded thinking decided I stopped believing in it. So now you can say I rebel against the concept of God. But I haven't lost the concept of love, justice, and peace. I believe I am a pretty darn moral person all in all. You can still be a good person without believing in God.
I may have taken your question out of context? But it struck a cord and I had to reply to it.
NC🙂
Originally posted by ncrosbyI think it's time to petition Russ/ RHP for a 'god bothering only' forum.
I didn't want to hijack the culture of death and the culture of death thread, so I thought I'd start a new one instead.
Ivanhoe said:
Do they realise that rebelling against God also means rebelling against love, justice and peace ?
I don't think that's a very fair statement. Years back I was a believer, attended church, went to a christian c ...[text shortened]... have taken your question out of context? But it struck a cord and I had to reply to it.
NC🙂
All those in favour say 'aye'.
AYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYEEEEEEEEEEEEEE ( system monitors recorded 28.9 million responses) CARRIED Let the result be entered into the minutes. Can I have a motion to destroy the voice tapes? Thank you - a seconder? - thank you - all in favour. Against? The motion is carried. If thats all the general business then this meeting is concluded.
Amen
Actually Skeeter, I really enjoy discussing religion as do a lot of people. I know it's a touchy subject and a lot of people would rather not see it in the forums, but as long as people don't bash each other back and forth, I don't see a problem with it. It's an interesting subject. And I am curious about Ivanhoe's question.
So no bashing in this thread allowed!!! 😀
NC🙂
I too am against this concept that if you do not believe in religion then you are immoral. Some of them most immoral acts undertaken in the world have been for religious "purposes". Not that non-religious people haven't commited such acts. Just that some people are ***** whether they believe in a god(s) or not, and some people are extemely nice whether they believe in a god(s) or not.
mark
Originally posted by ncrosby....and so shall it be written, and so shall it be done. 😏
Actually Skeeter, I really enjoy discussing religion as do a lot of people. I know it's a touchy subject and a lot of people would rather not see it in the forums, but as long as people don't bash each other back and forth, I don't see a problem with it. It's an interesting subject. And I am curious about Ivanhoe's question.
So no bashing in this thread allowed!!! 😀
NC🙂
Originally posted by ncrosbyIt is a Don Quichotte statement.
Ivanhoe said:
Do they realise that rebelling against God also means rebelling against love, justice and peace ?
I don't think that's a very fair statement.
NC🙂
How can you rebel against something you don't believe it exists?
Fjord
Originally posted by ncrosbyconcepts associated with god certainly are very different from my idea of desirable attributes. ( i like peace love justice etc)
I didn't want to hijack the culture of death and the culture of death thread, so I thought I'd start a new one instead.
Ivanhoe said:
Do they realise that rebelling against God also means rebelling against love, justice and peace ?
I don't think that's a very fair statement. Years back I was a believer, attended church, went to a christian c ...[text shortened]... have taken your question out of context? But it struck a cord and I had to reply to it.
NC🙂
to hear someone call themselves a "moral" person stirs a fear inside me much like someone who claims to have the "true" religion.
problem is that i consider myself a moral person too 😕
Originally posted by ncrosby
I didn't want to hijack the culture of death and the culture of death thread, so I thought I'd start a new one instead.
Ivanhoe said:
Do they realise that rebelling against God also means rebelling against love, justice and peace ?
I don't think that's a very fair statement. Years back I was a believer, attended church, went to a christian c ...[text shortened]... have taken your question out of context? But it struck a cord and I had to reply to it.
NC🙂
I don't mind at all you opening a thread on this question of mine. I appreciate it.
Maybe you wanna tell us about why you are (were ?) p*ssed at Him ?
It might help to get things clear.
Originally posted by mmanuelMmanuel: "I too am against this concept that if you do not believe in religion then you are immoral."
I too am against this concept that if you do not believe in religion then you are immoral. Some of them most immoral acts undertaken in the world have been for religious "purposes". Not that non-religious people haven't commited such act ...[text shortened]... are extemely nice whether they believe in a god(s) or not.
mark
I agree with you 100%.
My original question is a question about "what exactly is it you are rebelling against? ". Do you realise exactly what you are rebelling against ?
Originally posted by ivanhoeThe whole business of "anger at God" is threatening to many Christians. I hear that a lot "don't get angry with God", "It's God's will" etc. The longest book in the Bible is the book of Job and I like to think that there is a vey important reason it is even in the Bible. Job says, "It is my desire that the Almighty answer me." How better to get the ear of God than with 1) honesty and 2) anger. Somehow I am afraid that modern man thinks God would be threatened by his anger. There are many appropiate times to be angry at God. Be wary of that parent who never allows their child to speak his truth.
I don't mind at all you opening a thread on this question of mine. I appreciate it.
Maybe you wanna tell us about why you are (were ?) p*ssed at Him ?
It might help to get things clear.
Originally posted by kirksey957Well written post Kirksey, thanks! Food for thought.
The whole business of "anger at God" is threatening to many Christians. I hear that a lot "don't get angry with God", "It's God's will" etc. The longest book in the Bible is the book of Job and I like to think that there is a vey important reason it is even in the Bible. Job says, "It is my desire that the Almighty answer me." How better t ...[text shortened]... mes to be angry at God. Be wary of that parent who never allows their child to speak his truth.
NC🙂
Originally posted by ivanhoeWell. There are two stages in my life that I am talking about here, but the one I was most referring to was when I still believed in God and I rebelled against him. I don't believe in God at all anymore, not even for the reasons that made me rebel in the first place, that just brought on the beginning of my nonbelief.
I don't mind at all you opening a thread on this question of mine. I appreciate it.
Maybe you wanna tell us about why you are (were ?) p*ssed at Him ?
It might help to get things clear.
I don't want to get all personal here in the forums, so I'll just say that my anger and rebellion was spawned by the age old question of how God could let the terrible things that happen in the world happen. I was angry and I rebelled by speaking out against Him to myself and even to others, and acting in ways I hadn't before because of my belief. But during that time, as well as today when I don't believe in him at all, I honestly feel that I haven't lost sight of love, justice, and peace. And that's the point I was trying to make.
NC🙂
It simply depends upon your point of view. If you believe that God is the personification and source of all that is good (love, peace, etc.), then refusal of faith in him is rebellion against that which he personifies (love, peace, etc.). If you do not believe in God, regardless of personification, then obviously you do not concur that you are rebelling against such virtues as love, peace, etc.
Thanks Omnislash and Ncrosby. I appreciate your openness for the personal approach.
For myself it remains a mystery if there is an entity we could call God. A long time ago I accepted the fact that I just don't know and probably never will know. That is fine for me. The very fact that we exist is awesome to me. It is my experience that compassion is something you can find in believers, non-believers and not-knowers alike.
Fjord
Originally posted by ivanhoeYes, I am rebelling against the perpetuation of a two thousand year old creation myth (one of several thousand documented throughout the world). What makes this one any more special than the others?
Mmanuel: "I too am against this concept that if you do not believe in religion then you are immoral."
I agree with you 100%.
My original question is a question about "what exactly is it you are rebelling against? ". Do you realise exactly what you are rebelling against ?
Mark