Originally posted by Wheelydidn't expect anything of starship troopers except space opera. found the so-called satire fell rather flat and that most people missed that aspect altogether. In any event, the film was in my view completely lacking in humor.
I think you are expecting way too much from a movie about giant insects somehow throwing asteroids at presumably faster than light speed and with remarkable accuracy at a planet on the other side of the galaxy. Can't you just switch your head off and enjoy the fun?
I presume you wouldn't expect to be challenged by the Spice Girls movie, Mama Mia or The Ma ...[text shortened]... urosawa's masterpieces) and Zombie Strippers. Different movies for different occasions.
good sci fi flicks that I enjoy have sharp, funny dialogue, a lot of character development and many sight gags. Return of the Jedi stands out that way -- lots of laughs in that flick.
If a sci fi flick is going to rip off other, older sources, from magazines, TV shows, comics, etc., then it should do so with humor and clever writing backed by good acting and characters with some depth to them.
None of that was the case with the film starship troopers -- it was just a little above the Ed Woods level, but not by much.
Originally posted by ScriabinWell that's fair enough. If you enjoy a particular elements in a sci-fi movie and Starship Troopers didn't have them then it isn't surprising you didn't like it.
didn't expect anything of starship troopers except space opera. found the so-called satire fell rather flat and that most people missed that aspect altogether. In any event, the film was in my view completely lacking in humor.
good sci fi flicks that I enjoy have sharp, funny dialogue, a lot of character development and many sight gags. Return of the J ...[text shortened]... h the film starship troopers -- it was just a little above the Ed Woods level, but not by much.
In my view, however, that doesn't necessarily mean that people who do like it have somehow got it all wrong which I believe your original post implied.
I thought The Lord of the Rings and The Dark Knight were incredibly dull and boring (in the Dark Knight's case I'd add, appallingly badly written, desperately arrogant and tedious in the extreme) however, I couldn't chastise anybody for liking them.
Originally posted by PalynkaAgreed. Starship Troopers is a personal favourite, and I have always been at a loss to see how people could miss the absurdist satire (not just of fascism, but of any nationalist militarism - and, to be frank, of a caricature of the US as such a society) that forms the essence of the film. (Compare and contrast the film and the book on this: they are essentially polar opposites.)
If's funny how you were on the brink of understanding the motives of the director, but then you fail miserably by labelling it as a monster flick.
Fascism and militarism are all over Heinlein's book. Even if you failed to notice it when you were a kid, you sure as hell should have noticed it by now.
The film, in my opinion, portrays this excellently. T ...[text shortened]... erally recommend reading in sequence. The contrast between them makes them great complements.
But for the love of all that is good, never watch Starship Troopers 2.
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Originally posted by WheelyI don't chastise anyone for liking silly entertainment, only for trying to dignify it or mistake it for something serious or even artistic.
Well that's fair enough. If you enjoy a particular elements in a sci-fi movie and Starship Troopers didn't have them then it isn't surprising you didn't like it.
In my view, however, that doesn't necessarily mean that people who do like it have somehow got it all wrong which I believe your original post implied.
I thought The Lord of the Rings and The rogant and tedious in the extreme) however, I couldn't chastise anybody for liking them.
commercial dreck is dreck and can be fun -- but as for all this delving into its so-called depths, give it a rest already.
example: I do not feel Firefly was a work of art. But it was a very funny, and innovative way to make a sci fi flick on a shoestring budget and still get me to watch it all the way through, even though, or perhaps because, of all the inside jokes, sight gags, and allusions to past shows from both sci fi and western genres.
It was clever. It was fun -- but that's all it was and the creators of it are the first folks to admit it. They feel justifiably proud of having made a good commercial product -- that's what it was.
I don't think Starship Troopers was a good product. How much money did it make compared to contemporary products?
didn't see Dark Knight -- not interested.
Lord of the rings? boring. Why? I've outgrown the thing -- would have loved it 40 years ago.
biggest fault? taking itself so damned seriously. Anytime I see a sci fi fantasy sort of thing that recognizes its own absurdity and shows us that recognition, you got me. Humorlessness in sci fi and fantasy and you've lost me -- there may be exceptions, of course: El Laberinto del Fauno was a very serious piece of artwork and there was no comic relief.
But then, it wasn't a major American studio project.
All my criticism is in reference to American major studio works.
Foreign and independent films fall outside of the categories, the 37 stories, that major studio films are limited to.
Originally posted by ScriabinInteresting comment that to be honest ,doesn't feel like your earlier post but that could just be the amount of coffee I have had before reading it.
I don't chastise anyone for liking silly entertainment, only for trying to dignify it or mistake it for something serious or even artistic.
commercial dreck is dreck and can be fun -- but as for all this delving into its so-called depths, give it a rest already.
example: I do not feel Firefly was a work of art. But it was a very funny, and innovative ...[text shortened]... fall outside of the categories, the 37 stories, that major studio films are limited to.
I'm definitely with you with regard to these kinds of movies taking themselves to seriously. Some people actually find the Dark Knight deep! (but if you haven't seen it, you wont know why I have an exclamation mark there). There Will be Blood was another one. It seems as long as you use moodily lit close ups of a stern looking face and have at least one scene with people sitting doing nothing, that lasts in excess of three minutes, you're in art house territory.
I haven't seen the other sci-fi pictures you mention as I don't find too many of them very good these days apart from some of the drooling aliens kind. I did like Dark Star though and that has a bit of humour.
The whole Lord of the Rings thing drove me to distraction. It was pretty but was oh so dull. The first one particularly was what seemed like sixteen hours of people walking to a forest. It has to be said that the books are pretty much the same though and can only seriously be enjoyed if you keep skipping large wads of pages.
I don't like to rag on the American major studios as they can do some damn good movies. Sadly, they also do a lot of crappy, exploitative, popcorn stuff which kind of puts a blight on their image. Likewise, the independents, can also produce dull nonsense though the stories are generally much better developed.
The French seem to do a lot of good movies!
Originally posted by Wheelyah, French movies -- yes.
Interesting comment that to be honest ,doesn't feel like your earlier post but that could just be the amount of coffee I have had before reading it.
I'm definitely with you with regard to these kinds of movies taking themselves to seriously. Some people actually find the Dark Knight deep! (but if you haven't seen it, you wont know why I have an exclamatio ...[text shortened]... ories are generally much better developed.
The French seem to do a lot of good movies!
some movies I liked:
The Third Man
Citizen Kane
Lady from Shanghai
Touch of Evil
À bout de souffle
Orson's Macbeth
Big Sleep
Maltese Falcon
Treasure of the Sierra Madre
Casablanca
Bonjour Tristesse
The Searchers
My Darling Clementine
The Oxbow Incident
Chinatown
Doctor Zhivago
Kind Hearts and Coronets
Gaslight
Some Like it Hot
The Spy Who Came in From the Cold
From Russia with Love
Once Upon a Time in America
La Strada
Repulsion
The Seventh Seal
Hour of the Wolf
Les Quatre Cents Coups
Tirez sur le pianiste
Vivre sa vie
Jules et Jim
Fahrenheit 451
Les Carabiniers
L'Enfant sauvage
Le Mépris
La Nuit américaine
L'Histoire d'Adèle H.
L'Homme qui aimait les femmes
Le Dernier métro
Breathless
Alphaville
Cinema is the most beautiful fraud in the world -- Jean Luc Godard
also like almost all Clint Eastwood flicks