I'm not accusing anyone in particular, but I have seen mention of it in some profiles.....
I can see using it as a help tool in non-rated games, but in clan and tourneys, I would think it would take the joy of victory out by having a computer make one's moves.
I also understand in this type of set up, nothing can be done to avoid it other than the word of a stranger.
Any thoughts?
Personally, I will use a data base for appx. the first four moves of a game with an opponent that over rates me. This is new for me (I have argued against them in the past but have seen some reason, and application). I have discovered that the people with the highest rating usualy have a personal data base that is way beyond mine, and without the appropriate answer to their questions the game will be lost.
Mike
Originally posted by Wildekoyoteunless you have a extremely large db, it really isn't much use beyond the opening stages if your intention is to play by rote hoping to duplicate the actual moves. however, that intention is counterproductive anyway, because really large databases usually contain lots of very badly played games anyway.
I can see using it as a help tool in non-rated games, but in clan and tourneys, I would think it would take the joy of victory out by having a computer make one's moves.
where a db is very useful is looking at the way good players generate ideas in given positions (you can search for positions). remember that the 'best' move in a position is not necessarily the 'best' idea. so you will find that if you have a computer engine evaluate a particular position, it may suggest moves that a good player doesn't make, because the player has a long range idea that the computer doesn't. it can actually interesting sometimes to play through master games using a computer engine which will give very misleading evaluations because it really doesn't know what is happening in the big scheme of things.
this is why having a variety of ideas to look at using a db (not always possible with annotated games) can be rather exciting, because it helps develop one's own ability to generate ideas - but it takes some study and work. one of the problems inexperienced players face is arriving at a position and saying 'i have no idea what to do now'. interestingly enough that can happen with better players in a different way where they figure that the position has no play left in it. however, the really good players may still generate ideas in these situations. a highly ranked friend of mine from panama (who i used to help me out on FICS) once told me that he really admired kasparov because he was able to find life in the deadest positions.
in friendship,
prad
Originally posted by WildekoyoteYou make it sound like cheating, and it is not. It is all the info available to anyone playing correspondence chess... it is data to look at, not a computer making moves for you.
I'm not accusing anyone in particular, but I have seen mention of it in some profiles.....
I can see using it as a help tool in non-rated games, but in clan and tourneys, I would think it would take the joy of victory out by having ...[text shortened]... ne to avoid it other than the word of a stranger.
Any thoughts?
Most people who use database will stop if you ask... and if they really wanted to cheat they would use an engine, and not even bother with database.
I'm using it right now with Huntingbear... how else am I going to make the middle game against that guy!? I always say when I am going to use it, since it is now written in my profile... and I only do it 1 game out of about 9 or so.
Most often against a higher rated player, but sometimes I try to talk a lower rated player into using it to improve the game... I like to see everyone get better at chess!
P
Originally posted by PhlabibitGosh, now I'm blushing 😳
I'm using it right now with Huntingbear... how else am I going to make the middle game against that guy!?
LOL! Most my friends in the outside world think I'm some sort of master, but I would have thought anyone here at RHP would know better 😀😕
You didn't use a database for your fifth move did you? 😛
Originally posted by pradtfHi Prad 🙂
. a highly ranked friend of mine from panama ... once told me that he really admired kasparov because he was able to find life in the deadest positions.
prad
No ! No ! No !
Don't put the Secrets of Life on the Forum Prad !
If you share these secrets with all, most games will last 70 moves instead of 40 😲 😲 😲
The population of chess games might double, Russ will have to pay for extra storage and instead of 15usd we soon will be asked more.
Also everybody would have the same rating in the end, and we would have nobody to admire. No more Saints in the Church of Chess 😕
It all would end in Anarchy without role-models 😠
It would set a bad example for these other games we play ...
Just imagine !
Everybody could qualify to be american president in the end ! Or Pope !
Kindest,
Nononohup
PS Databases improve your games a lot ! I 've learned more from playing 50 'database' games than from playing 1000 blitz games.
I rarely use them beyond the opening moves - 7 8 9 moves - but I am sure they are a great help in the middle game as well.
Probably i belong to some Cult of Death - i've been using databases to reach a Dead Position against stronger players. Shame on me !!!
Looks like all like to use data bases, which is fine.
I never have, maybe I should start?
Are there free ones available?
I still don't think I'd use them in a tourney or clan games, even against a higher rated player, if I'm gonna get my butt kicked, the sting may seem less if I didn't get help getting to that point.
Excellent to get you through the opening :
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/explorer
In addition I use http://www.orgs.bucknell.edu/chessclub/openings/
which is giving you the basic ideas of most openings within seconds.
By surfing a little you can find a lot more on any particular opening.
Here are a few links to give you an idea :
http://members.shaw.ca/chess4us/caro-kann.htm
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/adam.bozon/budapest.htm
Beware ! You soon might turn into a Chess Freak and it all might end in tears , your wife might apply for a divorce or your kids might start to hate you because you monopolize the pc and they cannot get their daily dose of Lara Croft or Everquest 😲
If you want to search positions try this one :
http://www.chesslive.de/
Enjoy !
I think books are great too. I believe Akizy has 3000.
I also improved my game a lot by playing systematically all opening lines I never played before. I found some opening lines match 'my style' better than others.
Other great ways to improve are solving chess puzzles,
using a chess trainer
http://www.logicalchess.com/resources/lessons/tactics/easy/index.html
or watching video lectures
http://www.chess.fm/
On second thought my best games and my more spectacular games did often result from me playing a blunder at some time.
Trying to recover from a blunder is a great way to improve your game as well !
Huntingbear! It is your big fat rating that shows me you are better.... as for move 5 is in my CM9000 Book. Here is a picture to show my options I had.... I liked the move I did best.... Computer using engine for same move prefered to move Bd3... I just wanted to check to show I stuck with book, but didn't use the engine to pick my move! I guess you never saw that move? Neither have I... since I moved my 3 pawns in a line I never saw any of this Horwitz open!
Here is the picture:
http://www.riwire.com/images/CM9000Data.gif
Here is the game we are playing unrated....
Game 357708
Just as a side note, had I bothered to open the database I would have probably found a lot more games won using the Bd3... but I was treating my database more like a book of openings and picked a move I thought worked for me.
Wildekoyote! Yes, the only chess base I have is using CM9000, though I know there are ones online, and other programs like Fritz that have chess bases inside them. They will help you improve your game, but try and only use them when you like.
As for a clan game, I would hope the clan game is even. If it is even don't use the data... if the game is lop-sided... or the other player says they use data... you may as well for that game. If someone claned me against a 1600 player you better bet I'd use an open book and data!!!
Cyall!
P-
