Originally posted by abejnoodYou are NOT an American...you are an Iranian LIVING in America...and in the great state of Tennessee, no doubt! You will NEVER be an American with your attitude, therefore, may I suggest you pack your bags and get the hell out of America!! Go to Canada or Ireland where they'll kiss your A$$ ðŸ˜
Its rather obvoius that that moron Bush will go for Iran for cheap, worthless purposes. In fact, one of the reasons he stole oil from Iraq and started becoming a World Conquerer is because no war pesident has ever lost a re-election campaign. To quote Mr.Bush:
"...after all, Ah'm ah War President, Ah'm not going te lose da election..."
Believe me, Bus ...[text shortened]... is against the governments, and the their people. I hope we will not get into problems.
-Alborz
Your country (Iran) supports international terrorism. Your fellow Iranians are the same insurgents blowing up innocent people in Iraq and disallowing Iraqis to form a Democratic government; your Ayatollahs are bedmates to Osama bin Laden and Zarkawi....Iran is a tripartate of the 'Axis of Evil'.....you say Iran wants to advance into modern science when they won't even let their citizens have access to the internet, the Muslims persecute Christians living in Iran....what more can I say?...modern state?...ha, ha....
Originally posted by chancremechanicLet's look at it this way:
Your country (Iran) supports international terrorism. Your fellow Iranians are the same insurgents blowing up innocent people in Iraq and disallowing Iraqis to form a Democratic government; your Ayatollahs are bedmates to Osama bin Laden and Zarkawi....Iran is a tripartate of the 'Axis of Evil'.....you say Iran wants to advance into modern science ...[text shortened]... Muslims persecute Christians living in Iran....what more can I say?...modern state?...ha, ha....
Terrorism - The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.
1) unlawful
2) force/violence
3) against people/property
4) intimidating/coercing governments
5) ideological/politcal reasons.
The US unlawfully (without the consent of the international community) invaded and ravaged another country (killing 100k innocent lives) without any justified reason (Iraq has done NOTHING to us in the past 12 years; it harbors fewer terrorists than at least half-a-dozen other countries), has intimidated a form of government the US doesn't like and imposed one.
How has the US not performed international terrorism? The case can be made (easily) for Afghanistan; this so-called preemptive strike was a hoax, and can easily be defined as terroristic.
As for 'axis of evil,' I assure you, thanks to GWB, we are on many other countries' 'axis of evil' lists. It's a subjective term that has no static definition.
Nemesio
Originally posted by nemesioOh, so we should have gone over to Afghanistan and played hop-scotch with the Taliban? You're from Pittsburgh, and have these ideas?...any self-respecting Steelers fan would shiver with rage! Join your buddy on the next plane to Tehran!
Let's look at it this way:
Terrorism - The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.
1) unlawful
2) force/violence
3) against people/property
4) intimida ...[text shortened]... ies' 'axis of evil' lists. It's a subjective term that has no static definition.
Nemesio
Originally posted by chancremechanicWell, well, folks! The average arrogant AMerican is presented here.
You are NOT an American...you are an Iranian LIVING in America...and in the great state of Tennessee, no doubt! You will NEVER be an American with your attitude, therefore, may I suggest you pack your bags and get the hell out of America!! Go to Canada or Ireland where they'll kiss your A$$ ðŸ˜
Your country (Iran) supports international terrorism ...[text shortened]... Muslims persecute Christians living in Iran....what more can I say?...modern state?...ha, ha....
Now, to the facts. You have absolutly NO RIGHT to call me unamerican! I was born here! I was raised here! ANd unless I'm mistaken," freedom of speech, freedom of religion, etc". Now I think that accusing me here is not exactly the purpose of this thread. The purpose of this thread is to release good ideas. And, to be respectful of others decisions. This post here is cruel, offensive, inaccurate, and offensive.
Now, as to correct your posted mistakes. I will break this down one by one:
"Your country(Iran) supports international terrorism".
Excuse me? We do? Let's check the facts: not one Iranian has been connected to a terrorism attack, and when the U.S. accused Iran, Iran hunted down these criminals and gave them to America. Also, as an afterthought, there's a saying: Evil has no root". You call invading Iraq and stealing their oil "good"? You think having thousands of innocents die in Iraq "freedom and noblety"? Think again.
Now, about that childish accusation about Osama Bin Laden. Let me put it this way: Are Americans the same as English people? same as French? Spanish? This is the same case. Iran hates Arabia as much as you do, and more becasue we suffered at their feet once.
So you say Iran is an Axis of Evil? Give 3 examples of what they have done( and prove it with some resources besides America's messed up media).
And to adress your last few statements, I have to say: don't talk about what you don't know about. It will embarress you someday. We Iranians have access to the Internet, we are getting freeer by the minute, and without the U.S.'s help. And Iran will procede to be a modern state, if AMerica keeps like this.
I'm not saying Iran is perfect, but you should keep your mouth closed sometimes. Reconsider your words when you post as well.
Originally posted by nemesioThank you for this post. It is the first post I've ever thus far recommemnded
Let's look at it this way:
Terrorism - The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.
1) unlawful
2) force/violence
3) against people/property
4) intimida ...[text shortened]... ies' 'axis of evil' lists. It's a subjective term that has no static definition.
Nemesio
Originally posted by chancremechanicI think the Taliban gave people the death sentence for playing hopscotch. Thanks Chance for your extremely well-reasoned answer to the above post (by the way, they don't let you steer the ship or touch any sharp objects, do they?).
Oh, so we should have gone over to Afghanistan and played hop-scotch with the Taliban? You're from Pittsburgh, and have these ideas?...any self-respecting Steelers fan would shiver with rage! Join your buddy on the next plane to Tehran!
Originally posted by abejnoodOh, I'm sorry if the truth upset you...I'll get the story (lies and propaganda) from Al-Jazeera next time if it will make you feel better...I'm sure they aren't biased...NOT!!
Well, well, folks! The average arrogant AMerican is presented here.
Now, to the facts. You have absolutly NO RIGHT to call me unamerican! I was born here! I was raised here! ANd unless I'm mistaken," freedom of speech, freedom of religion, etc". Now I think that accusing me here is not exactly the purpose of this thread. The purpose of this thread is ...[text shortened]... t, but you should keep your mouth closed sometimes. Reconsider your words when you post as well.
"Your country(Iran) supports international terrorism".-quote from me
"Excuse me? We do? Let's check the facts"- quoted from you.
See, you are admitting that Iran (We) is your country, so that tells me that when the $hit ever hits the fan, you probably would not defend America....am I wrong?...if so, pardon me...but would you defend America?
Proof that you ask for: On December 14, 2001 Iranian leader Ali Akbar Hashemi-Rafsanjani stated that "when the Islamic world has the atomic bomb, the strategy of the west will hit a dead end-since the use of a single atomic bomb has the power to destroy Israel completely, while it will only cause partial damage to the Islamic world..from "Ttreachery"...Bill Gertz...crown publishing
Israel's destruction isn't a walk in the park for a "friendly" nation like Iran...
Originally posted by no1marauderSharp object?..like the point on top of your pathetic head?.....go marauding off somewhere...like a long walk on a short pier...
I think the Taliban gave people the death sentence for playing hopscotch. Thanks Chance for your extremely well-reasoned answer to the above post (by the way, they don't let you steer the ship or touch any sharp objects, do they?).
Originally posted by chancremechanicWe had a justification for Afghanistan. I don't dispute this.
Oh, so we should have gone over to Afghanistan and played hop-scotch with the Taliban? You're from Pittsburgh, and have these ideas?...any self-respecting Steelers fan would shiver with rage! Join your buddy on the next plane to Tehran!
What we are doing in Iraq is terroristic based on the criteria listed above:
1) unlawful
2) force/violence
3) against people/property
4) intimidating/coercing governments
5) ideological/politcal reasons
Show me how any of these things are not true.
Yes: I'm from America and I have these ideas. Any self-respecting American should feel embarrassed to have their tax dollars sponsoring terrorism.
With respect to America, Iraq has behaved itself. If America is going to intercede in other countries, I'd like to see it enforce some human rights in the dozens of countries, like where women are routinely executed because their friend's uncle accused her of adultery, or where farmers who are trying to subsist have their hands and feet chopped off just for growing a few carrots.
Do you know why we don't intercede in these places with grotesque human rights abuses? Because we have no economic interest. If they had oil (for example), we'd be all self-righteous and indignant.
GWB gambled that he would find a justification he wasn't sure was or wasn't there. He lost. There was no justification for attacking Iraq; what we are doing there is terrorism, using a by-the-book definition.
What's the tab now? $250 billion? And Bush is promoting another tax cut???
You don't have 10 maxed out credit cards do you?
Nemesio
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Originally posted by mateuloseI have to say that is a rather stupid comment. In a democracy people can vote for who they want for, the only price they have to pay is living with the consequences if it turns out to be a bad decision.
Anyways, there should be a rule, that if your state voted the same party all throughout history, it shouldn't have right to vote, because they are partisan, and do not have an objective opinion. That means states like Texas and Louisiana have no rights, and do not deserve any unless they learn to think objectively...
I think the US media need to focus more on Al Q. and the US goivernments failings to catch or locate that network rather than worrying too much about Iran first. Oh, there is also the little matter of Iraq to sort out first...
Andrew
Originally posted by chancremechanic
Oh, I'm sorry if the truth upset you...I'll get the story (lies and propaganda) from Al-Jazeera next time if it will make you feel better...I'm sure they aren't biased...NOT!!
"Your country(Iran) supports international terrorism".-quote from me
"Excuse me? We do? Let's check the facts"- quoted from you.
See, you are admitting that Iran (We) is your country, so that tells me that when the $hit ever hits the fan, you probably would not defend America....am I wrong?...if so, pardon me...but would you defend America?
Proof that you ask for: On December 14, 2001 Iranian leader Ali Akbar Hashemi-Rafsanjani stated that "when the Islamic world has the atomic bomb, the strategy of the west will hit a dead end-since the use of a single atomic bomb has the power to destroy Israel completely, while it will only cause partial damage to the Islamic world..from "Ttreachery"...Bill Gertz...crown publishing
Israel's destruction isn't a walk in the park for a "friendly" nation like Iran...
Originally posted by StarValleyWy
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?threadid=15939&page=1
"I agree. They are the sponsors of the attack on Spain. Let them have at it. More nukes the better. The most we will lose is New York. Big deal. We will then make them glow in the dark.
But I'm betting they hit Paris. It's a matter of ease and scarfs.
snicker.
"
Originally posted by abejnood
[In fact, one of the reasons he stole oil from Iraq]
My advice for you is to stop watching mainstream media for a week or two, and then start to think about statements like this.
[It's not because Iran will blow up the world;on the contary, Iran wants to do good and also wants to reduce reliance on oil and help decrease air pollution. Iran isn't going to use nuclear power to make a bomb; they merely want to advance into modern science.]
If you realy believe this, then I think you will believe anything.
[He wants Iran to be a so-called "stupid country" and not to advance.]
I can tell you this, Iran is not a "Stupid country. In fact I know many Iranian and they are very sophisticated. I do not believe that Bush thinks think. Again, please see my advise in point nr 1.
As a general comment: I am always amazed at how people suddenly think they have been promoted to amrchair generals, president, Intelligence Chiefs. This usually happens when you get pulled in by the media. They want you to think you are making educated discussions.
These comments are not intended to be personal. I have personally experienced the power the media has on our thoughts and attitudes. I lived in South Africa for many years and I ended up walking around with my pistol everywhere I went. Once I left SA and were no longer subjected to daily news of crime and murder and rape and vile things, I physically felt a difference.
If you think that the media (CNN, SKY, CBS, major newspapers etc.) are being objective, you are mistaken. And it is not that they are just opinionated, they have an active campagne against Bush. They only want to report negative things. I have watched several smaller news programms where they also report on the other side. A real eye opener.
Originally posted by nemesioHi.
Let's look at it this way:
Terrorism - The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.
1) unlawful
2) force/violence
3) against people/property
4) intimida ...[text shortened]... ies' 'axis of evil' lists. It's a subjective term that has no static definition.
Nemesio
Good definition of Terrorism. Unfortunately there are a few "legal" problems, if you wanted to make this a legal argument. There is no requirement in international law for a country to get the "consent of the international community" if it is acting in self defense.
Second, the definition spesifically covers individuals or groups. They have a different "locus standi" than a country. A country has sovereignty, peopel do not. So for a country to be guilty of terrorism you would need, for example:
1. They support a terrorist group by whatever means (Darfur);
2. They are acting against their own laws by undertaking military action - for instance a rogue general or group. That group will then be guilty and not the country (P.N. coup plot).
3. The country is in fact not recognised as a country in international law, and this group commits terrorism (Eritrea up to the point that they were recognised as a country)
4. Possibly: Any country that has authoritarian rule where the citizens do not have the power to use an election to change the government can be seen as illegitemate and their actions therefore not sanctioned by the state sovereignty.
So if you want to argue against the action of the US then the argument should be that the US did not defend itself. And I am very sure, that if you are anti-war, then you will have no problem to think of 1001 reasons why they did not act in self defense.
I would like to respond to the original question.
North Korea: Some people think the US will not invade because it won't be an easy fight. Nonsense. N.Korea is not just N.Korea, but it is part of the world where 2 other main countries are. Japan and China. I would classify China as a superpower already. There is only one way to handle this situation politically and that is trhough the regional leaders. The US will not engage N.Korea pre-emptively.
Iran: Not only do I think it will be very stupid to make a pre-emptive strike on Iran, but I also believe they will not. Iran and Iraq are totally different. I thi nk the US will try to work with the EU on solving the issues here.
Syria: I just don't see any reason why the US would attack Syria. Remember, contrary to whatever you belive of Bush, military action is the last option. It is very plain to see that with Iraq there was a planned and consistent cheating, fraud etc about adhering to the UN resolutiona. They same way you don't believe a thief for the 15th time that he will stop. Syria has no such record that I know of.