Discovered illegal position

Discovered illegal position

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A

Joined
17 Jul 11
Moves
538
16 Jan 12

Sorry if this has been discussed before, I looked and couldn't find it.

I recently played an OTB game and then we noticed that I had been in check for a while but we had both made several moves since the check took place.

I know it shouldn't have happened and I should have been paying more attention, but what is the correct procedure? Do we go back to the position when the check was made? If so, what happens to the clock in this case if it's a timed game? Or is it a draw?

Your answers would be appreciated.

e4

Joined
06 May 08
Moves
43363
16 Jan 12

If the game is over then the illegal move stands.

If not then the game goes back to the position before the illegal was played.
I'm not 100% sure about the clocks.
The TC or the two players would have to come decision regarding that one.

It's not as rare as you would think and has given me my last section
for the next blog - thank you.

K

Joined
21 Jul 04
Moves
38677
16 Jan 12
1 edit

Originally posted by AussieDave
Sorry if this has been discussed before, I looked and couldn't find it.

I recently played an OTB game and then we noticed that I had been in check for a while but we had both made several moves since the check took place.

I know it shouldn't have happened and I should have been paying more attention, but what is the correct procedure? Do we go bac ...[text shortened]... ock in this case if it's a timed game? Or is it a draw?

Your answers would be appreciated.
I assume that you play under Fides laws of chess:

Go back to the last known legal position. The arbiter must set the times after his best judgement. If the piece moved on the 1st illigal move can make a legal move - it should be moved (touched piece).


6.13
If an irregularity occurs and/or the pieces have to be restored to a previous position, the arbiter shall use his best judgement to determine the times to be shown on the clocks. He shall also, if necessary, adjust the clock’s move counter

7.4
a.
If during a game it is found that an illegal move, including failing to meet the requirements of the promotion of a pawn or capturing the opponent’s king, has been completed, the position immediately before the irregularity shall be reinstated. If the position immediately before the irregularity cannot be determined the game shall continue from the last identifiable position prior to the irregularity. The clocks shall be adjusted according to Article 6.13. The Articles 4.3 and 4.6 apply to the move replacing the illegal move. The game shall then continue from this re-instated position.

Edit: givin that the illigal moves/positions are discovered during the game. If finished the results stands - as G.P. says.

F

Joined
11 Nov 05
Moves
43938
16 Jan 12

Originally posted by AussieDave
Sorry if this has been discussed before, I looked and couldn't find it.

I recently played an OTB game and then we noticed that I had been in check for a while but we had both made several moves since the check took place.

I know it shouldn't have happened and I should have been paying more attention, but what is the correct procedure? Do we go bac ...[text shortened]... ock in this case if it's a timed game? Or is it a draw?

Your answers would be appreciated.
I helped with the after-game analysis. It was played in a quite low level. It turned out that the black queen was standing at E8 when the game started, and noone of the plaers noticed this. The game was played to the very end with a check mate. What would be the arbitrers judgement if the result was contested?

Answer: Nothing. The one who won won. The result stood firm.
Why? Because they both agreed to it and the protocol was signed by the loser.

But what would happen if one of the players noticed it before the end? Well, see the answer of the OP.

e4

Joined
06 May 08
Moves
43363
16 Jan 12
1 edit

Hi Fabian.

Do you have the score of the game in question?

PM it to me if you have it - don't post it.

FL

Joined
21 Feb 06
Moves
6830
16 Jan 12

This happened to me once. I was White in the following game:


At this stage my opponent played 9. ... Qxf3 and after 10. Bxf3 I was a piece up. A few moves later I realised that Black's 9th move had been illegal and we had to return to that position and continue from there. I think he played 9 ... bxc6 instead (I should have insisted on 9. ... Qxc6) and I eventually won.

F

Joined
11 Nov 05
Moves
43938
16 Jan 12

Originally posted by greenpawn34
Hi Fabian.

Do you have the score of the game in question?

PM it to me if you have it - don't post it.
You mean the protocol? No, I haven't.
Do you mean the result? No, it doesn't matter, they agreed to it.

e4

Joined
06 May 08
Moves
43363
16 Jan 12
2 edits

Hi Fabs.

I wanted the moves of the game. Never Mind.

Hi FL.

In The Lothian Championship many moons ago on the board next to me
I saw a dark squared Bishop landing on a white square.

The player who had it played against him (Alan Norris) spotted it right away and
cooly sat to see if he could take any advantage of it.
(he was now in a no loss situation. If he carried on playing he could wait till
he was losing and then take the game back to this move.)

Eventually he could see no plus with the Bishop changing colour so pointed out
the illegal move.

The player said 'OOPS Sorry.' and made a different move with a different piece.

Alan pointed out 'touch move' but the other player disagreed as it was an
illegal move he played.

A bit of a heated barney followed and I'm sitting next to it all on the Black side
of a dodgy looking Latvian. (Latvian's are always dodgy looking.)
The racket upset the other lad more than me.
The TC eventually ruled in Alan's favour (he won) and I drew a game I was getting gubbed in.

3 cheers for illegal moves!!!

d

Joined
04 Sep 07
Moves
14832
16 Jan 12

Illegal moves are a marginal but real part of face to face chess. I learnt this during one of my first club matches when my teammate (a distinguished septuagenarian) played Bf8-c5 with a pawn still on e7. Being young and naive I tried to point this ou,t only to be (rightly) told to shut up as they carried on.

Interestingly the RHP playing conditions are different, in that attempted illegal moves just don't register, there are possibly situations where this might even matter.

e4

Joined
06 May 08
Moves
43363
17 Jan 12

Hi dikankan

"Interestingly the RHP playing conditions are different, in that attempted illegal
moves just don't register,."

Game 4532104

On move 29. in this position.


The White Knight on e5 took the Black Queen on e3.

A few moves later The White Knight captures a White Bishop!

By coincidence it was one Fabian's games.

Felis Australis

Australia

Joined
20 Jan 09
Moves
387849
17 Jan 12

"This game has an incomplete game history and may not be reported correctly." Would this have been one of the times when the server was having a hissy fit?

A

Joined
17 Jul 11
Moves
538
17 Jan 12

Thank you all for the answers. This is why I love RHP.

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