Originally posted by divegeester
Game 11531695
My opponent started messaging me once we were down to king vs rook and king, insisting that they had played 100s of games in this scenario and never got anything more than a draw. However (even) I know that with a little patience and careful moves it's not too difficult to mate with rook and king.
At the end my opponent accuse ...[text shortened]... d my moves were more like a 1200 player.
Thoughts? Do I look like I have done anything wrong?
According to the Terms of Service the last time I looked at it books and so forth are allowed. What would comprise cheating is engine data, so the results of a calculation by an engine on that particular position, which in this case would refer to an endgame tablebase (EGTB). So even if you had looked it up on something like Wikipedia you'd be within the rules, which means he's pretty hazy on what constitutes cheating.
I checked 5 piece EGTB, comments start on move 43:
[Event "Clan challenge"] [Site "http://www.playtheimmortalgame.com"] [Date "2016.01.10"] [EndDate "2016.01.21"] [Round "?"] [White "divegeester"] [Black "RudySA"] [WhiteRating "985"] [BlackRating "1018"] [WhiteElo "985"] [BlackElo "1018"] [Result "1-0"] [GameId "11531695"] 1. e4 e5 2. Ng1f3 d6 3. d4 exd4 4. Nf3xd4 c5 5. Nd4f3 Bc8g4 6. h3 Bg4xf3 7. Qd1xf3 f6 8. Bf1b5 Nb8c6 9. O-O a6 10. Bb5xc6 bxc6 11. Nb1c3 g5 12. Nc3a4 Ra8b8 13. b3 Ng8h6 14. Qf3d3 d5 15. c4 dxc4 16. Qd3xc4 Bf8e7 17. Qc4xa6 f5 18. exf5 Nh6xf5 19. Qa6xc6 Qd8d7 20. Qc6e4 Nf5d4 21. Bc1xg5 Rh8g8 22. Bg5xe7 Qd7xe7 23. Qe4c6 Nd4xc6 24. Ra1e1 Qe7xe1 25. Rf1xe1 Ke8d7 26. Na4xc5 Kd7c7 27. Nc5a6 Kc7b7 28. Na6xb8 Rg8xb8 29. Re1e6 Rb8h8 30. a4 Nc6d4 31. Re6e3 Rh8g8 32. Re3e7 Kb7b6 33. Re7xh7 Nd4xb3 34. Rh7d7 Nb3c1 35. Rd7d2 Rg8c8 36. h4 Rc8h8 37. g3 Kb6a5 38. f4 Rh8g8 39. Rd2c2 Nc1d3 40. Kg1f1 Rg8xg3 41. Rc2c3 Rg3f3 42. Kf1e2 Rf3xf4 43. Rc3xd3 {At this point the game is drawn, to draw black has to take the h pawn first.} Rf4xa4 {This move changes the result - black is now losing} 44. Rd3d5 {This changes the result Rh3 was the only move leading to a win against perfect play.} Ka5a6 45. Rd5d6 Ka6b7 46. h5 Ra4h4 47. h6 Kb7c7 48. Rd6g6 Kc7d7 49. Rg6g7 Kd7e8 {This changes the result again, black needed Kc6, d6 or e6 and not to have his king on the back rank.} 50. h7 {Only move to avoid changing the result} Ke8f8 51. Rg7g8 Kf8f7 52. h8=Q Rh4xh8 53. Rg8xh8 Kf7g7 {Ke6 is mate in 13, this is mate in 12} 54. Rh8h4 {This, Re8 and Rh3 are all best moves in the sense that mate isn't delayed. For the rest of the moves I'll only comment if the move delays or accelerates mate} Kg7f6 55. Ke2f3 {Checkmate is now in 13, 55. Re4 for mate in 10} Kf6e5 56. Rh4e4 Ke5d5 57. Kf3e3 Kd5c5 58. Ke3d3 {Mate in 12, 58. Rd4 for mate in 10} Kc5d6 {Allows mate in 9, 58. ... Kd5 is mate in 12} 59. Kd3c4 Kd6c6 60. Re4d4 Kc6c7 {Mate in 5, 60. ... Kb6 is mate in 7} 61. Kc4b5 Kc7c8 {Mate in 2, 61. ... Kb7 is mate in 3} 62. Kb5c6 {Mate in 2, 62. Kb6 is mate in 1 (62. ... Kb8 is forced then 63. Rd8#.)} Kc8b8 63. Kc6b6 {Mate in 2, 63. Ra4 gives mate next move} Kb8c8 64. Rd4d6 Kc8b8 65. Rd6d8 1-0
Given that by the time it's K+R v K to change the result you have to drop your rook, that you didn't checkmate by the most efficient route, and that the result did change a few times at the five piece stage (K+R+P v K+R) I think that there is no evidence of cheating whatsoever.
The game demonstrates the problem with cheating accusations quite nicely. In the K+R v K part of the game you never put a foot wrong in the sense that you didn't make a move that would have drawn the game according to EGTB - but since you'd need to drop the rook to do that it's not that surprising. There were a few result changing errors in the five piece part of the game (and some real howlers earlier on) but your accuser could just claim that you didn't start cheating until move 54, and it's almost impossible to prove that you weren't as the inefficiencies can be explained as you trying to cover yourself. So the only way to prove you weren't cheating in the face of that accusation is for the result to change, which is ludicrous as it leaves you needing to blow the ending to prove you weren't cheating.
Am I cheating?
21 Jan '16 20:472 edits
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